Official Transcript of the American Military Tribunal in the Matter of the United States of American, against Erhard Milch, defendant, sitting at Nurnberg, Germany, on 3 February, 1947, Justice Toms, presiding.
THE MARSHAL: The Honorable, the Judges of Military Tribunal No. 2. The Military Tribunal No. 2 is now in session. God save the United States of America and this Honorable Tribunal. There will be order in the Court.
THE PRESIDENT: You may proceed.
DR. BERGOLD: May it please the Tribunal, for the time being I would like to read from Exhibit No. 11 of my document book. Another passage I would like to read when last Monday I skipped certain parts for the Tribunal It's on page 26 of the original and Exhibit No. 11. It's on page 50 of the German document book.
JUDGE PHILLIPS: What page in the American document book?
DR. BERGOLD: Also page 50 in the American Document book. That is page 26 of the original concerning certain statements made by Milch. That is, concerning the terms "shirker." "Milch: That is not the way I meant that. By "shirker" I mean a man who on the first of March signs a contract with Junkers, does not work there, then loses his job on the first of April, signs another contract with a different firm, does not work there for about 14 days, then he becomes sick or reports sick for the rest of the month and does not show up at all and sometimes he is in a bad mood so the factory says 'get the pig out'. Such a man under such circumstances will appear 12 times a year. Those are the people I call "shirker". Not the good house-father who has to take care of his house." What I mean by that, he is referring to people whose homes have been damaged by bombs. I shall continue. "We are taking care of all of those matters as soon as possible." I shall close this quotation. And now I would like to introduce as Exhibit No. 12 NOKW-337, on page 57 of the German document book. I think it's also on page 67 of the English document book. This concerns the shorthand report concerning the Jaegerstab meeting of the 6 March 1944. in the Reich Aviation Ministry.
THE PRESIDENT: We havn't found it in the American book yet.
DR. BERGOLD: That's page 65, your Honor. It can be found in the index. It comes after Exhibit No. 11, after the last number I-124.
THE PRESIDENT: This is the meeting of the 6th of March?
DR. BERGOLD: Yes, sir.
THE PRESIDENT: The document on page 65 is the meeting of the 25th of April.
DR. BERGOLD: No, sir. It's the 6th of March. It's page 67 of the German document book.
THE PRESIDENT: Page 54 of the American document book.
DR. BERGOLD: Thank you. I shall begin now. "I see a great many unknown faces and I do not know what business all of these gentlemen have here. I suggest that a check be made at the door and that the showing of passes be mandatory. Otherwise there is danger that other people may sneak in here. I demand therefore stricter control under all circumstances. Furthermore I would ask that the gentlemen are present at meetings only as long and no longer as their business makes this necessary. I would therefore request that the gentlemen in question report his presence and says, I have only a few matters of general interest. These things could then be taken up first and that would settle that and the man could leave. We only want one gentleman for one subject, not a whole bunch of them."
May it please the Tribunal, I introduce that in order to show that the Jaegerstab meetings not always prove who was there at a certain given time and those meetings changed so that as far as the defendant Milch is mentioned, this does not prove he was there ail of the time. I shall continue:
On page 11 of the German original: "Saur: Does the term "construction company" exist at all? I think it does exist. Diesing: We have construction companies with the Luftwaffe. Among them masons, slaters, window fitters etc. That is how we arrived at the term "construction company." We cannot again withdraw the construction companies which we have taken from Berlin.
For each building site we need approximately 100 skilled people, this on the basis of a fixed distribution key and we do not know where t o get them."
There was introduced by the prosecution and also presented an exhibit from this Jaegerstab conference where the term "construction company" was mentioned in such a way, those were companies of concentration camp inmates. This explains the term "construction" company clearly. I shall continue:
Page 18 of the German original: "Milch: Now we come to the question of foreign exchange. Here the Fuehrer has announced his consent that the requests of the Slovaks to purchase anti aircraft guns, etc. be complied with. Saur has reported orally how many anti aircraft guns have actually been finished and how far we have exceeded the program. This is a good and acceptable method for us."
This passage proves that the Slovaks and their government who had been sent to Germany in order to create foreign exchange, Slovak could buy anti-aircraft guns from Germany. The Slovaks were not slaves.
I shall then continue and go to the next exhibit, Exhibit No. 13, that is NOKW 336, the Jaegerstab meeting of the 17th of March 1944. That is on page 56 of the English document book. Did Your Honors find the passage?
Shorthand report concerning the fighter staff conference presided over by General Field Marshal Milch on Friday, the 17th of March 1944, at eleven o'clock at the Reich Air Ministry. Rage 8 of the original, the last part of it.
"Stobbe-Detleffsen"--this man was the chief of the construction department in the Speer Ministry, in the remarmament ministry-- "I want to raise the question as to how far we have gotten with the two engineering constructions planned for the works. The one is a construction scheme at Otmershausen, the second the construction at Kaufring, originally small-scale constructions. They were cancelled and I was informed that the manufacturing firm for Ottmers hausen has not been determined yet. But we need the producing firm if we want to develop this plan. It was also said that Kaufring had become doubtful once more. I want to stress the fact that we must at any rate be clear about the manufacturing firm for both works. Otherwise, delays will be as far-reaching as we have experienced them during the last months. Now the question arises: Perhaps one construction should go to Junkers or to Central Germany or to this firm or the other. This is not the way to get results with the firms. I have not yet received official information and my attitude is that I need works at Ottmersheusen and another at Kaufring, but I shall be glad to be otherwise informed.
"Milch: You are right. This must be decided at once. We have promised Daimler-Benz at the time that the destination would be told him on the 13th. It was not told him. The whole matter has not been cleared up to now.
"Saur: On our last inspection tour we gained the impression that the time had come to get a clear view on the following points: What have we ordered on the whole of final evacuation space, on how many did we start, what dates have we fixed, what orders remain? I am under the impression that we do two things separately, which ought to be done together. We have, of course, at every plant with very few exceptions determined also together with phase I, the decentralization above ground, also phase II, the transfer underground, at least in broad outlines.
Now come the two large scale constructions. They have in the meantime been definitely ordered by the Fuehrer for a minimum space of 600,000 sqm each. Since we are not in position, first of all because of our program and then again on account of supplies, to build two new works independent of the total number of works already planned, with a capacity of 800,000 sqm, (that means from 2,000 to 3,000 to 4,000 airplanes each) we have to get clear on phase 3 or 4 if we term the present stage phase 1, decentralization phase 2, the evacuation underground now carried out with single buildings phase 3 and those large scale constructions phase 4. It is therefore very difficult to decide today where the two large scale constructions should go to when one does not even know the following: What is being done in the two big projects, who is doing it, and whose means will be converted into the big construction projects according to plan? It seems evident that the big construction projects in the form which we have now secured within the Fighter Staff can be finished in an incredibly short time. But to obtain tool-making machinery of recent origin within this limit of time for such large scale projects is impossible.
"Milch: It is not necessary, either.
"Saur continues: Therefore this planning of large scale projects is to be planned under no circumstances as a clear phase 4, that is, independent of phase 3, but within the framework of phase 3. That means either a series of minor scale projects up to 100,000 some are eliminated or we have find another approach to these problems. I have, therefore, arrived at the conviction to approach things perhaps from two different angles. We had the impression in the Erla district that the conditions there were rather favorable and that one could perhaps make this Erla district, which, is some distance from the parent concern, one of the pillars of the large scale project A and that one could in this way first carry out a decentralized evacuation of Erla, but would then have the first large enterprise complete under shelter. According to my opinion, the second thing could be measured, however with great difficulty." That is not quite clear in the original.
"I am not quite clear on that point and shall therefore proceed with circumspection. Maybe Junkers could be considered with his exceedingly concentrated works which God grant may be spared for some time. But who knows whether they may not be smashed much sooner than we fear. With regard to the construction project for Junkers I am not quite sure whether we ought to change to concrete. I considered the possibility of amalgamating the project Anhydrit, which as far as I know in its final state will amount to 200,000 sqm with the project Mittelwerk if one dry a discussion on this subject will be possible. The Mittelwerk project amounting to almost 130,000 now and increasing to 200,000 in its final state is located in its immediate neighborhood, and I do not doubt that we might find a possibility of getting additional 200,000 sqm."
THE PRESIDENT: Dr. Bergold, may I interrupt? What are you trying to prove by this long statement?
DR. BARG0LD: I want to prove, and that will come at the end, that the two great plannings here which were ordered by the Fuehrer, and according to the exhibit submitted by the Prosecution, he ordered Hungarian Jews to be assigned. I want to prove that one of these plans had been dropped, the plan Kaufring. This plan was dropped by the lighter Staff and later on a smaller plant was built there where Jewish workers were used. But this had nothing to do with the Fighter Staff anymore. The prosecution ins proved Only that at Ottmershausen 3,000 Jews had been used.
Of we read on, we will find that the decision was then taken. I want to Drove also that these plannings, if they were ordered by the Fuehrer, were not final and were not decided yet in a final way.
THE PRESIDENT: Well, it isn't clear to the Tribunal what connection there is between allocating the various plants, determining their size and what should be manufactured, and the use of slave labor. Does this tend to throw any light on that?
DR. BERGOLD: Yes. The prosecution has alleged that these greet plants were made by slave labor, and I want to show that this plant in which, according to the allegations of the prosecution, Hungarian Jews were used, that this plant was not built by the Fighter Staff and that therefore the prosecution has not proved altogether that the Fighter Staff used Hungarian Jews.
The passage will show in a very short tine that concentration camp innates were not used. Let me read one page further on and you will see that.
THE PRESIDENT: The difficulty is that you are reading so much that has no bearing on the point that you are urging. For example, the number of square meters in a particular plant appears to us to have no relationship to the use of slave labor. Now perhaps somewhere in this document there is a reference to the use of slave labor. Is it necessary to read all the rest of it?
DR. BERGOLD: No, I didn't want to read the whole thing. For the time being I would like to show to the Tribunal that the Fighter Staff did not plan the construction works, but only issued the instructions as to what should be planned in what factory. I believe I have proved that so far and think the Tribunal understood that. Now I shall skip a few parts. I would have done that anyway, that is, to skip a few passages.
THE PRESIDENT: We approve of that.
DR. BERGOLD: On the same page I would like to read a final sentence down here at the bottom so that the Tribunal can understand that these figures mentioned were highly exaggerated. It is about in the middle of that particular paragraph which begins on page 12 of the original. It begins with "The following was very interesting for me: When we received the figures for the decentralized evacuation program carried out at present, building costs if 108 millions were submitted to us. When Herr Schlempp afterwards in the train made a more detailed calculation with his experts on the project comprising 600,000 sqm, it worked out to 100 millions. That means that perhaps we have to revise again cur own plans at hand drastically."
Then I shall proceed to the next page. I shall read the statement made by Stobbe-Detleffsen, the last five sentences of the German original, the question concerning the great construction works. It is shortly before Saur makes a certain statement.
"The question of the big works is s Very difficult one for us from the point of view of capacity. It alone requires another 25,000 workers. We reckon already now 100,000 men for the tasks of the Jaegerstab. The switch to some other work would constitute an inroad of unheard-of proportions into the remaining amament economy.
"Saur: 100,000 without Kammler."
He continues: "Including the manpower we give Kammler but without the people from concentration camps.
"Saur: It was clear to us from the beginning that 200,000 men will be switched over."
"To switch over" the way it is used, or the way it was used at the time, meant to take them out of one factory and put them in the other factory, from one work to the other work; that is, move them from one work to the other work.
The Prosecution has already read the next paragraph.
I would like to read on the following page, the last paragraph concerning the statement made by Milch. I shall begin on page 16 of the original:
"We have been ordered to carry out these two construction projects by the Fuehrer. If I take now a higher compression ratio and thus attain much higher figures, even this higher figure would not prevent us from having to deal with further shifting afterwards, besides concrete works and cave works, smaller other caves, tunnels, etc. It is now doubtless correct to ascertain (1) What has to be constructed (2) for whom has it to be constructed (3) where has it to be constructed. We have to distribute it in such a way that we can efficiently cope with manpower and all the other questions, power, transportation, etc."
Now page 17 of the original:
"Stobbe-Detleffsen: May I refer back to Ottmershausen and Kaufring. Both building areas have been chosen in such a way that the original project of 60,000 square meters can without difficulty be enlarged up to 600,000 square meters. I certainly believe that if we now depart from these building areas, and actually lock for a new spot, we shall have to take a loss of nearly a quarter of a year."
I am going to skip now to Saur.
"Sauar: It does not have to be situated near Erla, but the point is whether brains for leadership are at Erla. I would think it correct if one of the constructions, which definitely has become a big construction project, would be enlarged over the initial echelon of 60,000 square meters which we will have to discuss anyhow these next days. We cannot assume the responsibility to shift underground a power installation of 60,000 square meters.
"Stobbe-Detleffsen: In this case Ottmershausen, which is unquestionably the most favorable - would remain and we would put Kaufring into the reserve.
"Milch: If we enlarge Ottmershausen up to 600,000 square meters, which I would welcome, the second big works with 600,000 square meters cannot be in the same region but must be located elsewhere feb many reasons "Saur:
How far away from each other are the works?
(some one calls out, "60 kilometers".)
"Stobbe-Detleffsen: These big works cause transportation problems, housing problems, etc., to unheard of proportions.
Saur: One of these works can be put up."
Then their allocated interest was dropped. I shall proceed to the next exhibit, NOKW 347, this will belong to Exhibit No. 14 concerning a Jaeger Staff Conference dated 20 March 1944. It is the next page to the page that I just read. Your Honors may know that meeting superseded the meeting of the 25th of March where the defendant Milch had to hold a speech, if the court please, before the Masters and Engineers of the Luftwaffe, and the prosecution read several passages out of this particular conference. The point I would like to prove is why this conference took place, and what its purpose was. That is important because later on I Would like to prove out of what psychological reasons Milch made such a strong term, and used such strong terms after the meeting of 23 March. I quote:
"Saur: With this we can come to the fundamental issue. Herr Nobel, your task is to make suggestions in a few days, or at the latest in a few weeks as to what measures must be taken in order to bring the production in the Luftwaffe shipyards in this area up to the same output as in factories of a civilian type."
Those are factories of the Quartermaster general.
"I guarantee you that there are reserves to be mobilized, that it will be a joy. That is this we must employ stringent means is clear. The gentlemen will be amazed when I make my suggestions to you. The shipyards must, in part, go over into private hands.
"Nobel: For this purpose I have asked Fieldmarshal Milch to speak to the gentlemen of the responsible commands on Saturday. They must bring along with them the needed spirit, the rest we will surely got there.
"Milch: The chairman of an armament commission is suggesting that the airbase or shipyard-repair industry should be given into the hands of private enterprise.
We too should like that very much. Up to now, however, it has not been possible that the GL get them. He has had no influence at all on it. In our office we have no undivided technic, but the technic has been neglected all along the line, and it has not been possible to do that as yet. The question must be discussed with the Quartermaster-General. These I see considerable difficulties." That is what he wanted.
On page 54 of the German original:
"Saur: Gentlemen, today we are taking up again the discussion of problems in a range that I consider too extensive. he are having here an administrative discussion. It is the business of the staff member for labor deployment to prepare and present such problems. It is a shame that we have to make suggestions to the staff member for labor, instead of his doing it on his own initiative."
You can see by this record they don't only have various decisions but a lot of talk which had no bearing to those particular meetings. Then I shall proceed to the next exhibit, that is, NOKW no. 365. This will become Exhibit No. 15. This is the Jaegerstab Discussion on 12 April 1944. That is the page following the one I just read. I shall now read shortly a report of the Jaegerstab Discussion, presided over by Hauptdienstleiter Saur, and later on by Fieldnarshal Milch. On 12 April 1944, page 51 of the original, the last line.
"Saur: Please tell this to Schmelter. We are in an incrediable situation as a result of lack of man-power. Here we are in the middle of the month already, and the 10,000 people distributed according to red slips have not arrived yet. A way must be found to assure priority for red slip matters over all other allocations. Tell Herr Schmelter to contact Gauleiter Sauckel still today. Going further than t at, the discontinuation, transfer or concentration of every other type of production must be brought about by us at once.
"Schaaf: The 4,000 people from Kahla".
That proves that the great figures which Saur mentioned all the time were not fulfilled, not even 10,000 people to be delivered. This is only on paper, that is all.
I shall now skip a few sentences.
"Lance: Schmelter's people complain particularly because they have no means of making pressure demands to Sauckel which will also be complied with."
This proves the Jaegerstab did not have any influence on Sauckel.
"Saur: Fialdmarchal, the best thing would be for you to approach Sauckel yourself since he is the man in charge of labor assignment.
"Milch: I shall tell him that the 10,000 red slips were not covered."
That is all Milch agrees to. He tells Sauckel he did not keep his promise. I shall now proceed to the following page. It is Exhibit NOKW 334. This will become Exhibit Number 16. This is the Jaegerstab Discussion of the 25th of April, 1944. This page 65.
"Shorthand Report on Jaegerstab Discussion on the 25th of April, 1944, presided over by Fieldmarshal Milch."
"Herr Saur does not appear until towards the end of the meeting.
"Wegener: I have a question for Schelter: Has the question of the transfer of West European workers been settled?"
I would like to say who Schmelter was. He was with the Rearmament Ministry and will be called as a witness.
"Werner: On this I can say that especially for Bavarian Motor Works, matters are particularly difficult because we can transfer only Russians and concentration camp inmates, and the staff used for supervision consists mostly of Belgians and Frenchmen."
Your Honors, these people were not abused because, naturally, they were allies, that is, they were allies in their hearts.
I shall now proceed to the following page.
"Kreutz: Mueller declared at one time, and he believed he could do it, the that he would try and shift a part of the head personnel within the concern.
"Schaede: If you bring the French key personnel to Lorraine I can g guarantee you that they would have fun away within the shortest possible time. That must be told to the firm. Even now they do not return from their vacation."
Your Honors, if foreign workers can have vacations, then, of course, you cannot say they were slaves. They were free people. According to their contract, they were entitled to their vacation.
"Milch: It will work only if were place these people into barracks. It is true we cannot treat them as prisoners of war; the outward appearance must be different, but in actual practice that is just what it must be.
"Schaeder: I merely wanted to suggest to the firms to take along as few French people as possible so that they would not lose them altogether but would rather follow the system of Mueller.
"Milch: Exactly. And if then there are still some left one can say that this will be limited in terms of time, perhaps to several months, and that in return certain advantages will be granted to them because they will be subject to certain deprivation of their freedom."
Your Honors, the Prosecution read passages of this. He spoke about putting them in barracks. That was just a precautionary measure. Milch then mentioned that it was only a limited measure, and that it should be discussed with the people. He thought they should get certain privileges. I can say to someone who is free, that I will put him in barracks and say that he will be free or that he will have certain other privileges. He agrees to that. That is not a matter of slave treatment.
THE PRESIDENT: Dr. Bergold, this has reference to the French workers only, does it now?
DR.BERGOLD: Yes, My Lord. I can always prove only part of that I shall now proceed.
I want to skip a few statements on this page. I shall proceed to the following page where Milch explains his attitude a little more clearly. I refer to Page 67 of Your Honors' Document Book.
"Milch: As early as today at noon, we may face the situation that BMWAllach is completely destroyed and that we have to get out. Then we cannot deal with things such as 200 or 300 French people who cannot come to Lorraine. That must be explained to the Fuehrer once more. Otherwise, I see no possibility for carrying through our assignment.
"Personally, I am firmly convinced after the conversations with the Fuehrer that he will then consent provided it is being done in a sensible way. The people must not sit together with the population and they must not be able to conspire. Nor should they have sufficient freedom of movement to be able to pass the green border line. Both of these things must be prevented.
"In compensation for these restrictions we can, on the other hand, give these people something and make them happy, be it even with cigarettes only."
The next Exhibit is Speer Exhibit Number 34. This will become Exhibit Number 17 in my Document Book. I shall give one copy to the Secretary General. It is a certified copy of the exhibit which was introduced at the case before the International Military Tribunal by the Defendant Speer. It reads as follows:
"The Fuehrer "Fuehrer's Headquarters "21 April 1944 "To the Reich Minister for Armaments and bar Production and Head of the Todt Organization, Reich Minister Speer.
"I delegate Ministerialdirektor Dorsch, Chief of the Todt Central Office, to carry out the erection of the 6 fighter production buildings ordered by me, while retaining his other functions in your sphere of work.
"You are to be responsible for taking care of all prerequisites necessary for the speedy erection of these buildings and you are particularly to effect the best possible coordination with the other war essential buildings, if necessary referring to me for a decision.
"Adolf Hitler."
This copy was certified by D.I.W. Goode, Captain and George N. Garrett, 2nd Lieutenant, Infantry.
This proves that the Fuehrer himself ordered those large construction works, the execution of which is charged to the Defendant.
Although I mentioned before that the Jaegerstab was of the opinion that it could only build one factory, the order was given by Hitler to build six. That was a.n impossible number. He delegated this duty to Mr. Dorsch. That man had his orders from the Fuehrer and not from the Jaegerstab, which, of course, was no longer responsible for his activities.
I shall now proceed to the next exhibit number. It is NOKW 389. This will become Exhibit 18. This is the Jaegerstab, Fighter Staff Conference on 2 May 1944 at the Reich Air Ministry. This is page 69 of Your Honors' Document Book. This is part of the statement made by Milch.
"Milch: First of all, I should like to express our thanks and recognition for the April results to all the gentlemen of the Jaegerstab, the the members of our Central Committees and the Industrial Council, the gentlemen of the Office of the GL and our industries.
I think Herr Saur has already said the same. I would like to mention Herr Saur personally, as we owe a tremendous amount to his particular initiative and energy."
This statement will be understood when a witness will be interrogated. They have talked about the importance of the Witness Saur and the Defendant Milch; that is to prove that the leading man in the Jaegerstab was Mr. Saur.
The next passage refers to the exhibit introduced by the Prosecution concerning sabotage in an air armament factory where Russians started a fire and thus caused a revolution. Because of this revolution, people were shot, which of course is a process which would lead to death in every other country. When prisoners of war strike, it leads to death. The Prosecution had these passages.
"Schaeder: Apart from enemy action, there is one very unpleasant matter.
"Milch: The case is not to be considered as typical, but it is bitter."
This shows that Milch did not draw his own conclusion like Mr. Saur did and that particularly referred to what was introduced by the Prosecution. He said this was a single case and that it does not have to be mentioned here.
I shall now come to the following Exhibit which is NOKW 362. It will become Exhibit Number 19. It is on Page 70, Your Honors. This is the Jaegerstab Conference of the 2nd and 3rd of May, 1944.
That is the next page. This concerns a Fighter Staff Conference about the 5th trip of "Operation Hubertus." This trip was also introduced by the Prosecution and the views of these workers in their particular ore works was mentioned there.
Milch was not present there. He did participate in the trip; however, he did not participate in all the conferences. I shall now read on Page 107.
"Milch: Now I should like to suggest that we should go on to our separate committees according to plan. We will meet here again at 2015 (or 8:15) for our final discussion."
That follows the single discussions which were introduced by the prosecution where Milch was not present. Now on Page 108:
"Saur: Now for the final discussions."
On Page 115: "Saur: Field Marshal, the individual conferences arc over.
"Milch: Gauleiter! Gentlemen! I would like to thank you for having pieced yourselves at our disposal here and hope that you will support our work. I close with the German salute."
This shows that Milch only arrived at the end.
We will now proceed to the following exhibit, which is OKW-1390. This will become Exhibit No. 20, Page 17 of Your Honors' book, concerning the Fighter Staff Conference on the 4th of May 1944. That is on the following page. This again concerns that revolution which was started by the Russians.
"Shorthand Minutes of the Fighter Staff Conference of the 4th of May 1944"; on pages 13 and. 14 of the original.
"Milch: Has the Erla question been cleared up, what is really smashed up there?
"Lange: I have the report here. It only means a fortnight's interruption. Then everything will be running again. The report says that no surfaces have been lost. Only the single parts are burnt.
"Saur: That must be closely investigated. In view of the weakness of the leadership at Erla, either the Central Committee or the Special Committee will have to clarify the situation.
"Lange: The report is of general significance. The measures worked well because a bigger disaster was prevented. The Russians wanted to start this fire so as to kill the guards.
Then they wanted to go to the village and start a massacre. It's rather similar to what was established at Conradi where the 1,000 Russian officers are. As a result, I had a search made and we took everything away from the Russians. But it is necessary that all the camps are thoroughly searched.
"Saur: Who made the report?
"Lange: Works delegate Ruodel."
Page 14: "Milch: I do not quite understand. Has the material for 200 surfaces been completely lost; i.e. have 200 surfaces been put out of action because of this affair?"
This is a very serious result where there were lots of plans to kill the guards and. to cause a massacre in the village; thereupon, if they should want to make an example out of them and some of the prisoners were shot, this is nothing in particular, and I think that would happen in any other country where PW's would commit such revolt.
I shall now proceed to the following exhibit number, and shall point out that Milch had nothing to do with that matter. Of course, that will come out when I interrogate him. Exhibit Ho. NOKW-443. This is Exhibit Ho. 21, concerning the Fighter Staff Conference of the 5th of May 1544 and it is on Page 73 of Your Honors' Document Book. It's on the following page of the one we just read.
"Stenographic minutes of the Fighter Staff Conference, on Friday, 5 lay 1944.
"Schmelter: I was supposed to report yet on the employment of labor in the penal institutions. The Minister of Justice has not yet forwarded the complete list of workers available in the penal institutions. I have made another inquiry. Dr. Schmelter has appointed Attorney Marl as special official in charge. He is the liaison to the Reich Ministry of Justice."
I shall now skip a few sentences and shall proceed where Hayno speaks:
"Such conversations have taken place. They do not get us anywhere. The thing we need is a listing of all localities showing now large a number of prisoners are yet available there. When we must see whether they are required there.
Herr Schmelter planned to concentrate then professional workers in those spots. There are only two to three percent professional workers in all among all prisoners. That is too little."
Your Honors, in all vicilized. countries, also in Germany, penal prisoners have to work. How one carries on such a penal plan was carried out in Germany where the concentration camp inmates worked late in Germany. This happened within the frame of the law which existed in Germany. There was nothing in particular. This work of concentration camp inmates cannot he considered slave work.
I shall now proceed to the following exhibit, No. NOKW-361, which will become Exhibit Ho. 22. It's the Fighter Staff Conference of the 8th to 10th of Hay 1944. This is on Page 74 of Your Honors' Document Book.
"Stenographic Minutes on the 6th Trip of the 'Undertaking Hubertus' from 8 to 10 May 1944." This is from Page 15 of the original.
"Milch: When shortly thereafter His Highness, the Regent, made his visit to Headquarters, the Fuehrer asked me to come to see him at a very late hour at night and ordered me to establish now immediate contacts with the Hungarian Government in order to fortify on the broadest possible basis the opportunity which now exists to an even greater extent to expand and to secure the capacity of Hungarian armament too for the common aims in the field of aviation."
Your Honors, the prosecution also presented this speech and the Prosecution thought that one could conclude that this was slave labor. This passage, however, shows that this was an agreement between the German and the Hungarian Governments which at the time was the legal government, and ordered to expand that particular armament of Hungary. What the Prosecution has introduced docs not prove that this is slave labor.
I shall now proceed to the next document, NOKW-336. This will become Exhibit No. 23. This is the Jaegerstab Conference of Friday, the 26th of Hay 1944. (Minister Speer and Field Marshal Milch entering.)
"Milch: I welcome our Minister Speer for the first time in the circle of the Fighter Staff and would like to express my special happiness and at the same time yours that you, dear Speer, are again with us, well, cheerful and in the old creative- spirit.
"This machinery, created by your orders, accomplished excellent things in the three months of its existence. It has made special efforts to bring the production of fighters and all that goes with them to a high level." This proves that the Fighter Staff apparatus was built by Speer, so to say.
I shall now proceed to Page 75 of the original. There seems to be a mistake made by my secretary. The name of the person speaking was omitted here. It is Mr. Schmelter who is speaking.
"The reports of the board of examiners show that a larger number could be deducted from the plants belonging to the Luftwaffe if one succeeds to establish joint direction for the department of plane constructions, the technical plant groups and companies.
"Field Marshal Misch: The quarter-master-general to whom all are subordinated. No one is subordinate to me."
Your Honors, I would like to mention here that these records here have some very funny expressions. It should read: "Therefore, it was impossible to get more workers." The next sentence will show that where it says that, "To deduct workers would only be possible if there was one leadership." Therefore, it should say, "Under three leaderships it is impossible; under one leadership it is possible." Therefore if we are to prove that these records contain millions of mistakes, it cannot be proven.
I shall now continue to the next page--the continuation of the age which I shall introduce. It is a continuation of he Prosecution's Exhibit where the defendant is charged that he had to see it that he foreign laborers also had to work for 32 hours and that he mentioned that they were shirking. This on only be understood, however, if were the whole thing. I would like to add the following part which as omitted by the Prosecution. Schmelter mentions of those people who are working around, here, 'Probably they are working in factories where they don't have to work for 72 hours.
"Milch: Then one can equalize. Isn't it possible, to avoid injus tice toward our workers, to have our other plants work too, not all of them for 72 hours, but perhaps up to 64 hours?