Q. All right. You took up your studies.
A. Yes.
Q. How long did you stay?
A. Until August 1943. Then I passed my big legal examination and that finished that.
Q. Now we are in August 1943. Then your assignement in Russia, with which we shall concern ourselves in detail, was in the midst of your legal studies?
A. Yes.
Q. Now, I would like to conclude your professional c areer. What happened after you finished your studies in August 1943?
A. Before I finished my studies, I had tried to find employment in the Criminal police, but I could not get this because of official requirements as they told me. Instead, effective the 1st of September, 1943, I was sent to the Inspector of the Security Police and SD in Koenigsberg as a Government assessor. I held this position until the 30th of August, 1944.
Q. When you worked for this Inspector of the Criminal Police and SD in Koenigsberg, did you have any executive duties or powers?
A. No, even the Inspector himself did not have such power and certainly then I couldn't have them.
Q. Can you say with one sentence what your activity was during that period?
A. In order to summarize it in one sentence To aid the Inspector in the fields of police and administrative law and to cooperate with the authorities of the Interior Administration.
Q. Now we are on the 31st of August, 1944.
A. Yes.
Q. What happened then?
A. At that point I was transferred to Augsburg. The State Police Agency there, because of lack of personnel had been dissolved in the first years of the war and had been reorganized into a branch office Augsburg agency as far as personnel was concerned and gradually to take over its former competencies.
When this reorganization had been completed in February or March, 1945, the appointment of a commander took place -- to whom I was subordinated -- as Chief of Department IV.
Q. And after the capitulation?
A. After the capitulation, I went back to the headquarters of my office in Augsburg and there I reported to the CIC of Third Army.
Q. Now, let's come back to the Russian assignment. This has already been mentioned on the occasion of your studies. How did this come about? Did you volunteer?
A. No, I did not. In Hay 1941 approximately all the candidates of the Leading Service who were studying in Berlin were assembled in the Leaders School of the Gestapo in Berlin and the then Chief of Office I told us that our studies would have to be interrupted immediately, since we had to be available for other more urgent tasks. He did not tell us anything about the nature of the work. A few days later, the entire group of students was sent to Pretzch, where other forces of the Security Police and SD had already been assembled and forces of the Regular Police and SS also joined us.
Q. One moment. Another question. This group of students, was that the group of which Herr Schulz spoke on the witness stand?
A. Yes.
Q. And to which Mr. Fendler belonged?
A. Yes.
Q. And how long did you stay in Pretzch?
A. As far as I recall, that could have been about three weeks.
Q. What happened during those three weeks?
A. They were essentially taken up with military training and a number of innoculations. This looked like an officer assignment, but we couldn't find out anything about the objective. It was the general opinion that the long awaited campaign against England was at hand.
About the beginning of June we were distributed in the forces already assembled and the Einsatzgruppen and Einsatzkommandos were set up. BY THE PRESIDENT:
Q. witness, before you go into that, just a question please: What did the military training consist of at Pretzch?
A. Practically speaking, it was a brief basic military training. The important thing was to give these men a sense of belonging together to make them feel as one unit. The military training was limited to drills, marching, terrain exercises, terrain intelligence and a short course in the firing of weapons.
Q. Were you given military training in tactics, military tactics?
A. No, within the officer group terrain intelligence was discussed, and map reading -- that is really the most important thing -- and, if I may add, what we call terrain exercises, terrain games.
Q. What did you do in this type of exercise?
A. A problem was given us. Two groups were formed and one would try to reconnoiter the other and would have to find it.
Q. How long were you in Pretzsch?
A. About three weeks.
Q. Had you had any military training before?
A. Yes.
Q. Had many of your comrades had any military training before?
A. The officers, almost all of them. The members of the police, almost all. The only exceptions were those on an emergency war status. In their case it varied.
Q. was the Defendant Fendler with you?
A. Only at the beginning. We were sent there together and afterwards we were distributed among various places and even in Pretzsch we were in different groups.
Q. But you both received about the same kind of training during the time you were there?
A. In Pretzsch itself, basically yes.
THE PRESIDENT: All right. Proceed, Dr. Linck. BY DR. LINCK (Attorney for the defendant Ruehl):
Q. Thus, when these three weeks were over, there was a distribution and I think you wanted to say something else about it. To what group or to what kommando were you sent?
A. May I add that Einsatzgruppe D was then transferred to Dueben as their garrison. Here I was assigned to Special Kommando 10-B, whose commanding officer was Major Bersterer.
Court No. II, Case No. IX.
Q. Now we are in Special Kommando 10B. Will you now tell the Tribunal about your mission as exactly as possible, the position which you had in that kommando?
A. No administrative officer had been assigned to this Kommando. Since during my time with the SS I was in charge of the administrative business of my unit and since I had also been active in the State administration, all administrative jobs were given to me. I took care of these jobs until I left the Einsatzgruppe. My first-job in Dueben was therefore to look after quarters and supplies, look after equipment and taking care of the administration and organization of the forces which had come from all parts of the Reich and all branches. This work, as well as the military training already mentioned, took up my entire time until the Einsatzgruppe left at the end of June.
Q. I want to go back once more for a moment. Did you in Dueben hear about the aims and objectives of your unit?
A. In Dueben there was nothing announced about the aim or objective of the assignment, until, when war broke out with the Soviet Union, when it became clear through some lectures about Russia that we were to be sent to Russia for an assignment. About the type of our mission the Chief of the Security Police and SD in a speech in front of the entire group assembled there shortly before we left told us briefly that difficult missions were ahead of us and that he demanded absolute obedience from us and absolute fullfillment of duty.
Q. Herr Ruehl, a discussion with Gruppenfuehrer Streckenbach has been frequently mentioned here. Did you participate in this conference or did you hear anything about it?
A. I neither participated in this conference nor did I hear that such a conference had taken place.
Q. But you must have had some thoughts about your mission or you must have tried to find out something about it.
A. I considered it as a matter of course that as far as the assignment ahead of us was concerned we would have to do a job which resulted from the usual police activity, namely, the detection and combatting of all enemy forces, especially espionage, sabotage, Communist resistance movements, and so forth. That is how I understood the remark of Heydrich that difficult tasks lay ahead of us, that the carrying out of such missions in a war area would be so much more difficult. Since the commander who came later and who was completely unknown to me did not make any announcements on his part, I, therefore, say no reason to ask him.
Q. But when did you find out details about this mission?
A. Only later on, I think, in Chernovitz.
Q. Well, then, please continue your story. You left Dueben when, and where was your kommando committed at first?
A. On the 27th or 28th of June Group D left for its assignment in the southern sector and we were then told that our area would be the Caucasus. Within the Group the kommando moved via Iglau, Englaw, Arrat, Muelbach, until Chessburg in Rumania, where it arrived on the 3d of July and remained there for two days. There the kommando received, its first assignment and the order to move on to Chernovitz as their first garrison. After on the 4th of July an advance detachment had left Chessburg, the kommando followed on the 5th until Sochawa, where the kommando was divided up, while the commando himself with the major part of the kommando moved on on one next day, that is, the 6th or 7th of July, I received the order to take up quarters in Sochawa with the supply column.
BY THE PRESIDENT:
Q. What do you mean? I am afraid I am getting lost between Rodavia and Bessarabia. I don't know just where I am now. when die you arrive in Chernovitz?
A. Your Honor, the first parts of the Kommando, or I, or the commando, which do you mean?
Q. Well, first tell me at what point did the kommando divide.
A. One advance detachment already became independent at Chessburg and proceeded to Chernovitz on its own, with a few cars.
Q. I see, and of what group were you a member?
A. I belonged to the kommando.
Q. To the advance kommando?
A. No.
Q. The kommando itself?
A. To the kommando itself, to the bulk of the kommando.
Q. I see. and where did it go?
A. On the next day, the kommando went to Sochawa.
Q. And it arrived there when?
A. In the evening.
Q. What day?
A. On the 5th.
Q. I see, and then where did it go?
A. There the kommando was divided, that is, the commander himself with the bulk of the kommando moved on the next day, that is, the 6th of July, towards Chernovitz, whereas I with the supply column, that is, kitchen, ambulances, etc., remained in Sochawa. Persterer, the commanding officer, first had to clarify the situation in Chernovitz. We had no news about the situation there and I received the order to remain until I received, the order to move on.
Q. And then when die you receive the order to move on?
A. In Sochawa I remained about three to four days, that is to say, I left on the 9th or 10th in the morning and on the same evening I arrived in Chernovitz.
Q. I see, and there you joined up with Persterer?
A. Yes.
THE PRESIDENT: Very well, I see now. Thank you.
DR. LINCK: May I proceed?
THE PRESIDENT: Yes, yes. Please. BY DR. LINCK (Attorney for the Defendant Ruehl):
Q. I just want to ask you one more thing about this, Herr Ruehl. You are giving us exact dates, even the time of the day. Do you remember that exactly or do you have any facts written down about it?
A. I remember the march and the various garrisons very well. As for the exact dates, I would nit have been able to cite them, but, fortunately, the prosecution by submitting its reports helped me out here so that I mentioned I can cite with certainty.
Q. Thus you arrived at your first headquarters in Chernovitz. You came there a few days after the bulk of the kommando arrived, there and from the 9th or 10th of July on you were in Chernovitz?
A. Yes.
Q. What did you do in detail in Chernovitz? Did you have the same mission which you have already described on did any change take place? we are now on the assignment.
Q. During the entire assignment, my mission remained the same, namely taking care of the usual economic and administrative questions; among them are the directing of all personnel matters, the calculation of their monthly pay, the negotiations with German and Rumanian Army agencies for the purpose of allocation of food and PX goods, gasoline, maps, as well as the distribution of these items within the kommando.
Court No. II, Case No. IX.
THE PRESIDENT: Witness, was the pay of any member in the Einsatzoommando the same as would be paid to some one of an equivalent rank in the Army?
THE WITNESS: Yes, the same thing.
THE PRESIDENT: Very well. BY DR. LINCK:
Q Any other job? You were just listing the various duties? of personnel technical equipment, as well as the arranging of quarters for the technical personnel, that is to say, for interpreters, drivers, medics, guards, and kitchen personnel. In addition, and this was the case especially in Chernovitz, there were the repairs of the hotels which had been assigned to us by the Rumanian Army, which the Russians had left in a very poor condition, as well caring for Rumanian, Hungarian and German guests. see any other places around Chernovitz? I didn't leave Chernovitz with the exception, first of all, of one drive to Piatra Neamt, which was for the purpose of taking care of some economic and administrative matters, as well as calling the group physician. Secondly, when I participated in a one day military exercise in the vicinity of Chernovitz, which was for the purpose of military training.
Q Was one of your jobs also the matter of making reports? I mean by that, receiving of reports from the subcommandos, and writing of reports about the entire activity to the group? various experts were subordinated to the commanding officer personally, and got personal instructions from him; in the same manner they also reported to him personally. The making out of the reports about the entire activity of the commando was done by the commanding officer Court No. II, Case No. IX.
himself. sit down and write the reports with a pencil, and take them personally to the group. There must have been an orderly room, where reports must have been filed. Did you have an orderly room?
A In this sense there was no orderly room. May I add that the general keeping of the files about the administration and executive was not even customary in the centralized agencies at home. In addition, the commando during my membership in it was on the march, and this march was not of the type that the commando would move as one entity from one place to another, but that it was split up in various subcommandos or detachments which would take up quarters at various places independently of each other. The same thing is true for the various experts, who are designated by the Prosecution as staff officers. Thus, the subcommandos, and these research analysts kept their own files in order to have them right with them when they needed them. were a deputy of the commanding officer, or as it was phrased at one time, that you were the second in command of the commando. Will you please comment on that? nor was I ever active as such; nor did I ever have the function of socalled second in command. My functions were quite clearly delineated, and they were limited to jobs of my administrative officer, which I have already mentioned.
Q The Prosecution also claims that you were a captain. Were you as a captain, or senior officer, the highest ranking officer after the commanding officer, so that, therefore, you had special powers. the Prosecution, I was not a captain at that time, but a 1st Lieutenant, and as such I was neither the highest ranking officer, nor the senior officer after the commanding officer, and as such I would not have had Court No. II, Case No. IX.
any special power to command towards a higher ranking officer, or towards an officer of an equivalent rank in my commando.
DR. LINCK: May I make a remark about this, Your Honor. I want to point to these personnel files which the witness refers to. They are to be found in volume III-D, English page 90. This is Document 4808, Prosecution Exhibit No. 171. BY DR. LINCK: farther details about the mission of the Kommando in Chernovitz. Now we are in Chernovitz. What did you hear about that there? taining the security of the area, and that particular order of the Fuehrer pertaining to espionage, sabotage and Communist activity, looting, and other acts of violence would have to be stopped by all means, and that those who participated in it were to be shot. Special attention was to be given to Bolshevist functionaries, and to leading Jews, since they were bearers of Bolshevism, and, thus, ware considered to be the greatest source of danger for the security of the occupied territory. as they were, or did you think about them at all. Did you perhaps express such thoughts, Will you please tell us?
THE PRESIDENT: Doctor, let's have the date, please. Just when was this speech made by the commanding officer?
THE WITNESS: May I answer that?
THE PRESIDENT: Yes.
THE WITNESS: This is not a general announcement, Your Honor, because I came only later....
THE PRESIDENT: Well, just tell me when it was that the commanding officer of the commando told you what you have just related. Just give us the date?
THE WITNESS: I can not give you the exact date. It might have Court No. II, Case No. IX.
been 10 or 11 August.
THE PRESIDENT: All right. Of August?
THE WITNESS: Yes - no, pardon me, in July.
THE PRESIDENT: Very well. You can now answer the question which your counsel had put to you, if you will. BY DR. LINCK:
Q Another question, Herr Ruehl. Did I understand you correctly to say that this announcement of Persterer was made to you, not in the form of a general announcement to the commando, which might have taken place before?
A I don't know to what extent he informed the entire commando about this order. I doubt that he did. I assume, however, that he informed all the officers about it. orientation of your own person, because you arrived late. Will you then answer my question about your reaction as to this? of this order, I was still affected by it, because on the basis of my peaceful training, and activity, I had definite ideas about the job of the police, and I had definite ideas about how a criminal case was to be prosecuted and here I was confronted with an entirely new situation. I discussed this with Persterer. He said that these measures were not to be judged by the usual European standards. That the Bolshevists would not recognize any kind of International Law, and they would force us to such measures by their manner of conducting the war. Furthermore, we would soon have plenty of opportunity to convince ourselves of this. Moreover, the Army had similar orders about the Bolshevist commissars.
Q Herr Ruehl, I want this quite clear now. According to your testimony her, if I understand you correctly, this order of Persterer's only told you that certain acts are to be investigated and to be severely punished. That nevertheless certain acts would have to have Court No. II, Case No. IX.
been committed. I would like to know whether he discussed anything about people being killed for their membership in a race, something for which they could not be held responsible. In other words, that he said a Jew should be executed merely because he was a Jew, or a Gypsy merely because he was a Gypsy? nor did he later tell me anything about it during any time.
Q But how do you explain that? sterer was expressly forbidden to carry out the Fuehrer's Order to its full extent in the Rumanian sovereign territory. Therefore, in my opinion that was no cause for him to announce such an order to us, as it was not valid for this area.
Court No. II, Case No. IX.
Q But you finally left Rumania, didn't you?
Q What happened then? Why didn't he then tell you about it? to withhold these measures in the interest of reconstructing of the economy. May I repeat? He evidently made use of the possibility to relegate these measures in the interest of reconstructing of economy in the administration. That this possibility existed until the visit of Reichsfuehrer SS Nikolajew in September, or the beginning of October, and that this possibility was made use of to a large extent was confirmed by Ohlendorf and Nosske, The way I can see these things today, there was in addition the fact that so far as the commanding officers are concerned, that first Mogilew was very badly destroyed, and, therefore, there was a great need for additional manpower, for building up operations, reconstructing operations; secondly, that for a time after this the commando was committed in the rural areas, in which the commando X-A had been active before. This is true of the Ananjew, as well as for Alexandrowka; thirdly, that in the area of the Nogarisch Stepp, and in Skatowsk, so far as I was informed, there ware no Jews at all. At any rate I didn't see any. membership in the commando, you got no knowledge of measures which would have caused you to conclude that an order for the execution of all Jews, Gypsies, etc., existed. My question is quite extensive. Will you please think it over?
A Yes, I could say that. I learned about various executions, but in these cases according to what I heard, these were justified individual actions, that is to say, cases where the crime had been proven.
Q I will now show you several documents. First of all Document Book II-*.
Court No, II, Case No. IX.
THE PRESIDENT: Doctor Linck, if you are now going to take up documents, don't you think this might be an appropriate time to have a recess?
DR. LINCK: It would be very appropriate, yes.
THE PRESIDENT: Very well, the Tribunal will be in recess fifteen minutes.
(Recess)
THE MARSHAL: The Tribunal is again in session.
DR. STUEBINGER for the defendant Braune: Your Honor, I am sorry that I am not in my robe.
THE PRESIDENT: I still recognize you as a good lawyer even without your robe.
DR. STUEBINGER: I have a very brief request. The defendant Braune has been ill since Saturday and I could not speak to him. I would like him to be excused, therefore, from the session this afternoon and ask that he be brought to room 57.
THE PRESIDENT: The defendant Braune will be excused from attendance in Court this afternoon and will be taken to room 57 where he may consult with his attorney, with or without robe.
Dr. Linck, in your opening statement you referred to the fact that the present witness, your client, had appeared at the International Military Tribunal trial. Would you be so kind as to furnish us with the reference in the transcript to his testimony so that we might glance at it. That is, if you know it.
DR. LINCK: Yes, your Honor,
THE PRESIDENT: You may continue now with the direct examination. BY DR. LINCK:
Q. I want to show you some documents, witness, Herr Ruehl, first of all in Document Book II-D, it's on English page 45, German 48. It is document NO-587 and it is Prosecution Exhibit 92. It is the report by the leader of Special Kommando 10-b Persterer to the Army Group South of 9 July 1941. At that time Special Kommando 10-b on the 7 and 8 of July carried out a large scale search for Communists and Jews and on 9 July 100 Jewish Communists were shot within the course of this operation. Does this COURT II CASE IX concur with your statement and what do you have to say?
A. This report, as well as the contents of it; I have only found out about in Nurnberg here. I have already said I arrived in Chernowitz a few days after the Kommando arrived as I was stationed three or four days in Poltawa. Therefore, at the earliest I arrived in Chernowitz on 9 or 10 July. Therefore, I cannot say anything based on my own observations concerning this. In spite of this, however, I think that this shooting which is mentioned in this report of 100 Jewish Communists is incorrect and I shall give the reasons why. I think it is inaccurate. First of all, even if such measures were not generally discussed it seems to me comparatively improbable that about such an extraordinary measure I should not have heard at least something, a measure which after all was carried out at the same locality by the Kommando just before I arrived or which is supposed to have been carried out at such time. Second, it is very significant that Perster who was with the Army Group which was far away and had no possibility to carry out such an investigation that he should have made a report to the Army Group and that on the other hand should not have told anything to his immediate superior, the Group chief. Neither in his report, as becomes evident from the report of 11 July, which is two days later, nor during the inspection by the Group chief a few days later in Chernowitz itself, because he could have established the inaccuracy of this report at the proper place and at the proper time. Therefore, I am of the same opinion as Herr Ohlendorf who thought that it was here a tactical measure in order to be able to prove some kind of activity under any circumstances.
that is inaccurate, don't you? Can you give us any factual details of your own kommando, the kommando of which you were a member, and its commander?
A I think I can. The tendency to be able to prove some kind of activity or special activity, especially to Berlin, or at least to sustain that such activity has taken place, becomes even more evident, particularly evident in the final report concerning the activity of the kommando in the territory around Chernowitz of the 1st of August, 1941.
Q Just a moment, that is Document Book Volume II-D for "Daniel" English Page 39, German page 41, Document NO-2950, Exhibit 90. why does it become particularly evident here? Persterer expressed very clearly that during the days of the 8th and 9th of July alone, by the Rumanian Wehrmacht and the police in Chernowitz more than four hundred Jews were shot or were supposed to have been shot. Contrary to this he reports on the 1st of August to the Einsatzgruppe that in Chernowitz, in collaboration with Rumanian police force altogether 658 Jews had been shot. Although it becomes evident from the report to the Army Group South of the 9th of July that the by far larger part of these executions, namely more than four hundred, had been carried out by the Rumanians by themselves: Persterer, by quite consciously unclear formulation in the report of the 1st of August to the Einsatzgruppe, wants to give the impression as if the kommando had been responsible or at least had participated in all these executions. Really, however, the part that the Rumanians took in the shootings was the much more extensive one, because I know that even after the 9th of July - that is the day the report was made to the Army Group - other executions were carried out, in which the kommando itself did not participate in any way and of which Persterer only learned afterwards.
Q Could you give us examples for this? 1947.
Q This is Document Book III-D for "Daniel", your Honor, English Page 78, German Page 123, Document NO-4149, Exhibit 169. It is the fourth paragraph of this affidavit. That is this event of where 20 or 30 people were shot. Will you comment on this? by the Rumanians. I learned of this incident when Persterer requested me one day to accompany him to the Prud River, P-r-u-d- River, outside the city, in order to find out where the river could be crossed. When we arrived at the bridge, which had been destroyed by the Rumanians we discovered at the foot of the embankment there a heap of corpses. From Persterer's behavior it became quite evident that he had no knowledge about this before. He questioned the Rumanian guard and then the Rumanian officer about this incident, and the result was that this execution had been carried out by Rumanian units. A similar incident which happened a little before the incident which I have just described now. has been mentioned by Herr Ohlendorf on the witness stand. All these figures were then compiled by Persterer and thus, this large number of executions was brought about, and he thus tried to impress Berlin with a specially high number of shootings. if you are qualified to answer this. In how far did Kommando 10b participate in this at all in your opinion? part in one execution in which, according to my memory, about 12 to 15 people were shot. you found out about it?