A I was the Military Adjutant of the Commander in Chief of the Air Force.
I held the rank of Chief Adjutant. I had the job of keeping the daily journal and organizing the adjutant service.
Daily the military position was to be reported--the military situation was to be reported, and, military reports, so far as they were not reported by the offices themselves.
I had no command function.
QIn this activity did you know that on 25 March 1944, from the prison camp of Sagan, Stalag Luft 3, seventy-five English Flight Officers had fled?
AThe official incident is known to me, because at one time it was reported that a number of Flight Officers had fled.
Q Can you give us some information about the fate of these officers after their flight?
AThe fate of these officers is not known to me.
QWeren't you ever informed that fifty of these officers allegedly were shot while trying to escape?
AI was informed about that much later. I was informed that a number of these officers allegedly had been shot.
QCan you tell us under what circumstances these shootings were carried out?
ANo, I do not know anything about that.
QDid Reichsmarshal Goering order the shooting or did he have any part in these measures?
AI know neither of his taking part in these measures nor of any order.
QDo you know of the attitude of Hitler with regard to the treatment of so-called terror fliers who were shot down?
AIn the spring of 1944 the losses of the civilian population by bombings increased steeply. These attacks were directed against civilians who were working in their fields, against secondary railroads and railroad stations without any military significance, against pedestrians and bicycles, all within the homeland. This must have been the reason for Hitler deciding to give orders or to issue orders concerning measures against these fliers. That is as much as I know. Hitler was for the sharpest measures, and lynching should not be prevented.
QWhat was the attitude of the Reichsmarshal of the Air Force to this order?
AThe commander-in-chief and the chief of the general staff have expressed their opinion by saying that these attacks, which were solely directed against the civilians, should be condemned. However, no special measures should be taken against these fliers -- lynching and non-protection for parachutists. By the orders of Hitler, the Luftwaffe was forced to take into consideration these questions. It was desired to avoid the consequences of Hitler's opinion. A way will be found, and it was seen in the fact that measures were allegedly taken, but which should not be executed.
Then I received the mission, which was outside of my regular functions, to confer with the OKW about the definition of terror fliers.
In these conversations and correspondence, all these cases were discussed which, according to international law, could be considered as violations and criminal acts. By these definitions, lynching should be avoided. The correspondence, which took quite some time, also shows the tendency of the various officers to delay the solution of this problem. At the end of June, 1944, the definition of terror flier was stipulated. The stalag was directed to report all cases of violations but not to take any measures. By these measures the directive, in the sense of Hitler, was avoided.
QIn your opinion, therefore, could we say that the measures directed by Hitler were not carried out by the air force?
A Yes, that can be said. It can be said that the measures directed by Hitler were not carried out.
As well, the commanders of the air force can certify they had not received any orders to shoot enemy fliers or to turn them over to the SD.
QDo you have any knowledge about the fact that the air force had received directives to take hostages or to shoot them?
AI did not know of any directive or any order which has anything to do with hostages.
QNow one more question: Can you give us any information about the treatment of the five enemy fliers who, in March 1945, jumped into the Schorfheide and were captured?
AIn March, 1945, an American bomber was shot down after an attack over the Schorfheide. Part of the crew saved themselves by jumping. Some of those were injured. The injured ones were sent to a rest center hospital. The observer, an American captain, who had been a director in Hollywood in his civilian occupation, was interrogated by the Reichsmarshal about his mission and his jump.
DR. STAHMER:I have no more questions to this witness.
THE RESIDENT:Do any other Defendants' Counsel wish to ask the witness any questions? BY DR. LATERNSER (Counsel for the General Staff and the OKW):
QI have only a few questions to this witness. Which official position did you have when the war started?
AAt the beginning of the war I was at the War Academy.
QCan we say that the beginning of the war caused a happy sentiment among the professional soldiers?
ANo, one could not say that enthusiasm would have been caused by the beginning of the war. On the contrary, we took it with great seriousness. As young soldiers, we saw out mission to train the soldiers, to educate them, and to turn them into preparedness for the protection of our country.
QWhich positions did you have, then, during the war? Were you ever in the staff of an air fleet?
AI was never active in the staff of an air fleet, with the exception Of a short time as group commander.
I was also adjutant of the commander-in-
chief of the air force.
QAs chief adjutant, as you said before, with the commander-in-chief of the air force, you could get a lot of information about the Luftwaffe?
AAs much as I had the material, yes.
QNow, according to your possibility to get materials, did the chief of air fleets have any influence on political decisions or the manner in which the war was conducted?
AAccording to my information the chief of air fleets had no influence on any political decisions. Their job was the technical execution of the orders received, and orders about the conduct of the air war in increasing number came from Hitler himself.
QDid these chiefs of air fleets make any suggestions to take sharper measures in the conduct of the war?
AI do not know of any suggestions in this direction given by chiefs of air fleets. They were professional soldiers who held their positions on the basis of orders.
DR. LATERNSER:I have no more questions.
THE PRESIDENT:Does any other Defendants Counsel wish to ask my questions? Do the Prosecution wish to cross examine?
MR. JUSTICE JACKSON: I would ask that the witness be Shown document 1156-PS of the United States documents.
(witness handed document)
CROSS EXAMINATION BY MR. JUSTICE JACKSON:
QDo you recognize that document, witness?
ANo, I do not know this document
QI call your attention to the date, the 20 of March, 1941, and I call your attention to the fact that it purports to be a report to Reichsmarshal Goering on the 19 of March 1941 meeting.
ADuring the time of my service I only took part in military conferences if they were personal conferences only at the headquarters. I have not seen this document and I do not know anything about the facts at this conference.
QLet me call your attention to Item 2, which refers to you, I take it and which reads:
"The directives worked out by the W.I. for destructive measures to be undertaken by the Luftwaffe in the 'Fall Barbarossa' were agreed to by the Reichsmarshal. One copy was handed to Captain von Brauchitsch to be forwarded to the General Staff of the Luftwaffe."
And I ask you whether that states the facts.
AI can not remember these facts and I cannot give any more information about the contents of the letter mentioned here.
QYou knew about the "Fall Barbarossa"did you not?
AI was informed about the "Fall Barbarossa" in the beginning of 1941 for the first time. I was not present at the conference.
QBut you didknow that certain destructive measures were planned to be undertaken in connection with that by the Lufteaffe, did you not?
AI know only about the first orders of the Luftwaffe in which attacks against the airfields were ordered.
QDid it net also provide for attacks against cities, particularly St. Petersburg?
AAt the time at which this letter was written, as much as I remember, nothing was said about these targets but only about attacks against airfields, which were the main targets of the Air Force.
MR. JUSTICE JACKSON: I will ask that the witness be shown Exhibit 735-PS, in evidence as GB Exhibit 151.
(witness handed document) BY MR. JUSTICE JACKSON:
QThat is in evidence and appears to be a most secret document of which only three copies were made, is that correct?
AMay I read this letter first before I answer the question?
QI call your attention first to the signature at the end of it and ask you if you recognize who that signer was?
AThe signature is Warlimont.
QWho was Warlimont?
AWarlimont was the Deputy Chief of the Wehrmacht Fuehrungstab.
QAnd you knew him welland he knew you well, did you not?
AI knew him from seeing him and at that occasion I spoke to him for the first time.
QOn the occasion of this meeting that is recorded in these minutes, is that the occasion when you first met Warlimont?
AWhere I spoke to him first officially, yes.
QThat was on the date 6/6 of '44, when this meeting was held?
AAccording to this letter, yes.
QNow, I call your attention to paragraph one of the minutes of that meeting, by which it appears that Obergruppenfuehrer Kaltenbrunner opened the meeting with a report that a conference on the question of the flyers had been held shortly before with the Reichsmarshal, the Reich Foreign Minister and the Reichsfuehrer SS. That is the opening of it, is it not?
AI know nothing about the words of this letter and of the fact of that conference.
QWho was the Reichsmarshal at that time?
AI remember the fact because on the 6 of June the invasion started and in the night from the 5th to the 6th I called the Reichsmarshal, informed him about the beginning of the invasion and on the morning he left from Feldenstein to be in the afternoon in Klessheim.
Q And this meeting is said to have been held in Klessheim on the afternoon of 6/6, isn't it?
AI have said once before that I do not know anything about the meeting as such and the content of the meeting.
QYes, I understand, you were not present. That was between the Reichsmarshal, who wasGoering, was it not? Goering was Reichsmarshal at that time, was he not?
AYes.
QRibbentrop was Foreign Minister at that time, was he not?
AYes.
QAnd who was the Reichsfuehrer SS?
AHimmler.
QNow, it was as a result of that meeting at which the Foreign Minister -- just follow the next sentence -- "The Foreign Minister who wished to include every type of terror attack on German civilian population.
It was agreed that this conference, which you did attend, was to take place; is that not the sense of the first paragraph?
AI was not at this meeting and secondly, I do not know anything about the contents of this meeting, of this conference, as I have said before.
QWell, were you not at the meeting with Kaltenbrunner which Kaltenbrunner called?
AI was not at the meeting with Kaltenbrunner, which is mentioned here.
QDespite the signature of Warlimont on these minutes which says you were?
A I say this is spite of the signature but maybe I can read the whole document before I give a definite answer.
QRead the last sentence. Witness, I may be misinterpreting this. It does not say you were present but it does say that you gave them this information. I ask you to look at the last paragraph and say whether that is not true?
AThe last paragraph in this document before the signature can only refer to a conference which, if I remember correctly, took place on the 6th late in the afternoon in General Warlimont's house and which I have mentioned in my statement before.
QI think I was confused about the two meetings and that these minutes do not show you to have been present. There was such a conference as Warlimont describes but it was not the same conference at which Kaltenbrunner was present, is that correct?
AYes, that is correct. I only know of this one meeting on the 6th late in the afternoon, between Walimont and myself.
QAnd that is the conference to which he refers in the third paragraph?
ANo, the conference in the afternoon has nothing to do with the first paragraph, which I just read and there is no connection between the two.
QT he third paragraph had no connection with the first meeting, you say?
AParagraph three has no connection with paragraph one because I had no knowledge of paragraph one. I mentioned before that I had the mission to confer with the OKW about the definition of acts which were to be considered as violations of international law and crimes.
QLet us ask it once more so we will have no misunderstanding about it. The conference referred to in paragraph three of Warlimont's minutes is a conference between you and him later that afternoon and had nothing to do with the Kaltenbrunner conference which was held earlier in the day.
AYes.
QNow, what was the situation in the beginning of 1944 with reference to the bombing of German cities?
AThe situation was such that the air war increased in intensity and in the beginning of '44 it was very strong.
QThat was becoming very embarrasing to the Reichsmarshal, was it not?
A Of course it was very disagreeable for the Air Force that their defensive forces were too weak to stave off these attacks.
QAnd they were being blamed somewhat and the Reichsmarshal was being blamed for the air attacks, was he not?
AOf course, that goes without saying.
QAnd the Reichsmarshal was in the embarrassing position of having assured the German people back in 1939 that they could be protected against air attacks on the German cities. You understood that fact, did you not?
AI understand that that is the fact but I also know that the conditions in 1939, which led to this statement, had an entirely different background than in 1944; because in 1944 the entire world was against us.
QBut the fact was that German cities were being bombed and the German people had looked to the Reichsmarshal to protect them, isn't that a fact?
AIt is clear that the German people expected that the Air Farce with all means at their disposal would go against these attacks.
QNow, what were the relations between Goering and Hitler at this time?
AMay I ask to have the question repeated? I did not understand it clearly.
QWhat was the relation between Goering and Hitler and was there any change that came over the relationship as this bombing of German cities progressed?
AT he relations between the Reichsmarshal and the Fuehrer were doubtless worse than they had been before. Whether that was only based upon the conditions caused by the air warfare is not known to me.
QYou were very close to Reichsmarshal Goering throughout this period, were you not the entire period of the war?
AI do not know what you consider close. The relation of a commanderin-chief to his adjutant, that is what it was.
QWell, you were particularly friendly; he had great confidence in you and you had great regard for him. Isn't that a fact?
AI can affirm that but frequently -- well, conferences about the motives which the Reichsmarshal may have had we did not have.
QYou were with him on the 20th day of April, 1945, when he sent the telegram proposing to take over the government of Germany himself and was arrested and condemmed to death?
AYes, I was present at that time.
QAnd the SS seized you and the Reichsmarshal and several others and searched your houses, seized all your papers, and took you prisoner, did it not?
AIt is correct that on the 23rd of April at 19 hours we were surrounded. The Reichsmarshal was led to his room and from that moment on never remained without personal guard; that we were put in single custody and separated from him and that we executed by the troops of the SS, who were stationed at the Berghof.
QAnd this occurred at Berchtesgaden?
AThat happened at Berchtesgaden.
QI think you have told us that you were all supposed to be shot by the SS at the time of the surrender and were supposed to approve it by your own signature. Is that correct?
ANo, that is not quite correct.
I know that an order existed indicating that the Reichsmarshal with his family and those surrounding, at the time of the capitulation in Berlin, should be shot.
The second thing you mentioned is different. We should have been -we were about to be forced to volunteer for the SS. One has to say that the SS leaders did not want us there at that time and we were not forced to execute that order. At that time, however, we were already separated from the Commander-in-Chief.
QWhat was the state of your knowledge about the activities of the SS? What was the SS and what was its relation to the Wehrmacht at this time? What was its relation to the Air Force? Tell us about the SS.
AI can only say that as such, from the word SS, a lot could be understood. Speaking of the SS, SD, Gestapo, Waffen SS, they were entirely different units. The Gestapo, as such, was a means of pressure which prevented a great deal of free development.
Q And the SS likewise, as a matter of fact?
AThe Waffen SS was the military organization, the troops. I, personally, did not have any bad experiences with them, no difficulties, no friction with them.
QBut what about the SS proper? Brauchitsch, you know this situation about the SS, I am sure, and you impress me as wanting to tell us candidly whet you know about this situation, and I wish you would tell us a little, what the influence of the SS was on these situations.
AI pointed out once before that as a purely military adjutant I am only able to give you information about the Air Force, but I am not in a position to say anything about general things about which I have no technical knowledge, just a subjective opinion.
QWell, wasn't the SS the subject of a good deal of discussion among you officers, and wasn't everybody aware that the SS was an organization like the Gestapo that was repressive and cruel?
AIn the Air Force we had so many worries ourselves about the increase of the air power of the enemy that these worries kept us busy, more than sufficiently.
QBut you knew, did you not, about the campaign against the Jews of Germany and the Jews of occupied countries?
AI was not informed about the campaign against the Jews as it was pointed out here and as it went through the press.
QWell, I don't want to interrogate you from what is in the press, but do you want the Tribunal to understand that you had no knowledge of a campaign against the Jews in Germany?
AI only know about the cruelties and the extermination about which I have now read in the press. I did not know at the time.
QYour father was Field Marshal, was he not?
AYes.
QAt what period was he Field Marshal?
AField Marshal is a military ran which he had from 1940 until now.
QHe has never been deprived of his rank, is that a fact?
AHe was never deprived of his rank.
QThere came a time when your father, as you knew, disagreed with Hitler as to military programs?
AI know that my father at one time had great difficulties with Hitler concerning political and military questions.
QDid you not say to the interrogator who examined you for the United States that he retired from active command in 1941?
AYes.
QAnd what did you understand to be the reason for his retirement?
You gave the reasons as follows, that neither in the military nor in the political considerations did he see eye to eye with Hitler, and could not come to any accord, and since he could not make his own opinions prevail, he desired to manifest his dissent by resigning, and that specifically also referred to religious questions.
AYes.
QThat is true, is it not?
AThat is correct, and I will stand for it.
QI hope you are proud of it, sir.
You were also asked this:
"And from 1941 to the end of the war, do you know what he was doing?"
And you answered:
"Well, he had, through his second wife, a little house in a small town in Silesia, Bockenheim, and he occupied himself with studies of family history and also with forestry, economics, and hunting work, but did not take any share" -
A (Interposing) That was military history only, with economic question
QBeg pardon. I didn't get that.
AHe was only interested in economic questions and hunting, but not in military questions.
QNot in military, yes.
" -- but did not take share in any sort of bloody political endeavors."
You said that, did you not?
AMay I ask to hear the question once more.
QThis is your answer in full. You interrupted me. This is your answer to the interrogator:
"Well, he had, through his second wife, a little house in a small town in Silesia, Bockenheim, and he occupied himself with studies of family history and also with forestry" -- and, they have down -- "economics, and hunting works, but did not take any share in any sort of bloody political endeavors."
And, with the exception of economies, you still stand by that answer, don't you?
AI have never said that he ever took part in bloody things. It must be an error. I have never seen that protocol any more. I have not signed it
QI have not made myself clear. You said he did not take part in any bloody political endeavors. That is what this says you said.
AHe did not take part, but I have not said anything about bloody or any political endeavors.
QYou didn't use those terms in the examination?
ANo, I cannot remember that I said that. I have not signed that protocol and I didn't see it any more after the interrogation.
QAnd you say that you did not use those words on the 26th of February 1946 to Captain Horace Hahn, Interrogator?
AI say I have net used any expression about bloody endeavors or such, because that expression is foreign to me. I do not know in what connection I would have mentioned it.
QWell, you don't know of any that he did partake in, do you?
ANo. My father retired, yes.
QAbsolutely from this whole Nazi outfit. He cut his strings with them and retired to a little village rather than go on with the program he didn't agree with, didn't he? Isn't that a fact?
AYes.
DR.PECKMANN (Counsel for the SS): I believe that I do not have any more formal right to question this witness after Justice Jackson has interrogated him, but I would be grateful if I would be permitted to since Justice Jackson questioned the witness also about the SS.
THE PRESIDENT:The witness statement about the SS was that he knew nothing about it. I don't know what ground that gives for your cross examination.
DR. PECKMANN:He was asked whether, on Obersalzburg, he was guarded by the SS who also had orders to shoot him and to shoot Goering.
I would like to clarify whether that was SS or SD.
THE PRESIDENT:Very well.
RE-DIRECT EXAMINATION BY DR. PECKMANN:
QI ask the witness, therefore: Do you knew whether these people whom you have just mentioned were members of the SS or SD. Do you know the difference, Witness?
AI knew the difference generally. I believe that the troops which had the mission of guarding us were SS, but that the Sicherheitsdienst had the special order.
DR. PECKMANN:Thank you.
THE PRESIDENT:Do any of the other counsel for the Prosecution wish to cross-examine?
Dr. Stahmer, do you wish to re-examine?
DR. STAHMER:I have only two short questions. BY DR. STAHMER:
QWitness, can you tell us something as to how the relations between the Reichsmarshal and Himmler were?
AAs much as I am informed about that and therefore could give information, there existed between Himmler and Goering a relation which on the outside looked very careful, but one could not talk of the real relation between the two.
QCan you tell us something about whether the German people, until the last moment, still trusted the Reichsmarshal, and there was special confidence in the Reichsmarshal? Can you tell us about any particular incident
AI can mention two cases.
The first one was at the end of 44 or the beginning of 45 -- I cannot say the exact date -- in a public air raid shelter. The Reichsmarshal was without any guards, and he spoke to the people and they greeted him with the old slogan "Hermann, halt die Ohren steif", Hermann, keep your chin up.
Another example was on the trip from Berlin to Berchtesgaden, the night of the 20-21 April. On the morning of the 21st, towards noon, the Reichsmarshal arrived at a town in Sudetengau, Bohemia, where a short stop-over was made, and where, after a short time, the market place was filled by people.
He was asked for his autograph, and we could not get him out of the crowd with his own car.
Here also, he was greeted by the old shout, "Hermann."
DR. STAHMER:I have no more questions.
THE PRESIDENT:The witness may retire.
DR. STAHMER:As next witness, I name State Secretary Paul Koerner.
PAULKOERNER, a witness, took the stand and testified as follows: BY THE PRESIDENT:
QIs your name Paul Koerner?
AYes.
QWill you repeat this oath after me:
I Swear by God, the Almighty and Omnniscient, that I will speak pure truth, and will withhold and add nothing.
(The witness repeated the oath).
THE PRESIDENT:You may sit down if you wish.
DIRECT EXAMINATION BY DR. STAHMER:
QWitness, which official position did you have before the capitulation?
AI was the State Secretary of the Prussian State Ministry.
QIn this office were you one of the collaborators of the Reichsmarshal?
AYes.
QWhen did you first meet the Reichsmarshal?
AIn the year 1926
QWhen were you picked as collaborator?
AAt the end of 1939.
QIn what function?
AI was his secretary.
Q when were you taken into the Civil Service?
AApril 1933. Pardon; the previous date was '31.
THE PRESIDENT:The translator said the previous date was 1931; which date was 1931?
DR. STAHMER:In 1931 he first became Goering's private secretary. In 1933 he entered the Civil Service.
BY DR. STAHMER:
QWhich office did you hold?
AI became State Secretary of the Prussian Ministry.
QWhat do you knew about theinstitution of the Secret State Police, the Gestapo?
AThe Secret State Police was established in the first months after the seizure of power, was developed from the Political Police Department 1-A. Basically, the Political Police Department remained in existence, only it was newly formed, and got the name of the State Police.
QWhat was their mission?
AThey had to watch enemies of the State.
QAre you informed about the establishment of concentration camps?
AI know that at that time concentration camps were established.
QWhat purposes did they serve?
AThey were supposed to house enemies of the State.
QWhat do you mean by "house"?
AHostile enemies, elements hostile to the State, should be put into these camps.
QAnd what should be done with them there?
AThey should be taken into custody, and, as far as I know, a reeducation should take place in order to be able to return them to the mission.
QDo you know anything about the treatment which took place there?
AAs far as I know, the treatment was always good.
QDid you ever hear anything about so-called wild concentration camps?
AYes, in 1933, in various places, wild concentration camps were established.
QBy whom?
AI remember that one was established in Breslau by SA Obergruppenfuehrer Heines; one in Stettin. Whether there were any others, I do not know.
QIn Stettin? Who was it in Stettin?
AI think it was Karpfenstein, but I cannot be sure about it.
QAnd what became of these camps?
A When the Reichsmarshal heard about it, he had them dissolved because they were established without his approval.
QWhat was the Reichsmarshal's attitude to complaints?
AOh, he always went after the complaints; he went to the sources of the complaints.
QDo you knew of any case where he took special measures?
AYes.
QHow was it?
AThey had heard that the treatment had not been such as the Reichsmarshal wanted. He tried to get information about it and then had the man brought before him.
QWho was Thaelmann?
AThaelmann was one of the leaders of the Communists and he was a Communist member of the Reichstag.
QAnd how did the Reichsmarshal speak to Thaelmann?
AHe asked him to come into his office and requested that he tell him anything, why a complaint had been sent.
Q And then?
AThaelmann was very reticent at first, because he feared an offense, but it became clearer to him, after the Reichsmarshal spoke very plainly to him, that he could speak freely. Then he told the Reichsmarshal that he had not been treated correctly. The Reichsmarshal promised to do something about it immediately, and gave the respective directives; and he also suggested to Thaelmann that whenever such things occurred again he should report about them immediately. He also gave orders that whenever any complaints should come from Thaelmann, they should be sent directly to him.
QDo you know how long the Gestapo and the concentration camps were under the competence of the Reichsmarshal?
AUntil the spring of 1934; I believe it was March or April.
QUnder whose competence did they come then?
AUpon orders of the Fuehrer, they came under the competence of Reichsfuehrer Himmler.
QWhat do you know about the events regarding the Roehm revolt on the 30th of July, 1934?
AThat a Roehm revolt was planned I found out about when I was in Essen, where we were present at the wedding of Gauleiter Roehm. During the wedding ceremony Himmler reported to the Fuehrer. Later the Fuehrer confided in the Reichsmarshal and told him about the plans of Roehm.
QDo you also know what he told him?
AI can only say that what Himmler told the Fuehrer was also brought to the knowledge of Goering.
QDo you know any details?
ANo, I do not know any more details, but that is sufficient.
QWhat directives did Goering receive?
AThe Fuehrer directed Goering, after the wedding, to return to Berlin at once, and the Fuehrer went to Southern Germany to investigate these reports personally.
QWhen was that wedding?
ASo far as I remember, that was two days before the Roehm putsch.
QDo you know whether on the day after the Roehm putsch, the Reichsmarshal was to see Hitler?
A No. The Reichsmarshal was in Berlin. We returned, the same evening to Berlin.
QYes, and on the day after the Roehm putsch, after the 30th?
AThe Reichsmarshal was in Berlin.
QDo you know anything about whether there was a conversation between him and Hitler?
AYes. I remember that the Reichsmarshal drove to the Reich Chancellery to report several things to the Fuehrer, especially that the Reichsmarshal had been informed that on that occasion innocent people also could have been, or were the victims. Therefore, he wanted to ask the Fuehrer to stop the whole action immediately.
QWas that done?
AYes, that was done.
QIn what form, or in what manner?
AAfter the report of the Reichsmarshal to the Fuehrer, the Fuehrer personally issued directives that no wild actions should take place any more, that the actions were finished, and if any guilty people were found they would be sent to courts, which had to decide whether any action should be taken against the men or not.
QDo you know anything, or can you tell us something about whether the Reichsmarshal had anything to do with the action of the 8th and 9th of November, 1938, against the Jews?
ANo, the Reichsmarshal had nothing to do with it and had no idea of it.
QHow do you know?
ABecause I was with the Reichsmarshal on the 9th of November in Munich, and on the same evening we went to Berlin. If the Reichsmarshal had known anything, undoubtedly be would have told me, or these who were around him. He had no idea.
QWhen did he find out about it?
AHe found out shortly before he arrived at Berlin, at the Anhalte Station at Berlin.
QThrough whom?
AThrough his adjutant.