Both were not at hand. The Norwegian citizens were partly the first to leave their realm of their own accord. The administration in Hammerfest and in Talvik worked well.
Even in short periods for evacuation, a frictionless development is possible, if a calendar is also at hand in civilian offices for the evacuation of important goods. Idleness and avoidable losses of important goods result from improvising.
It contributes in any case to the quieting of the population, if every family can have at their disposal a memorandum with the individual orders for carrying out the evacuation. Such a memorandum was to be issued by Minister Lie according to the suggestion of the Army Hq, but came too late, to have any great effect on the population.
Some untoward events, such as the execution of the "Law concerning hand and span services" with the separation of the men from their families to be deported and with guarding like prisoners, burning down of houses in the presence of the inhabitants even where an immediate destruction was not necessary and shelling of the locality Kjellefjord by units of the navy, hinder the readiness of the population to follow the officially prescribed way.
(sgd) Herrmann Col and Leader of the Evacuation Staff Distribution:
In draft
MR. RAPP: On page 23, Your Honors, is a breakdown of evacuations as of 25 November 1944. It is an enclosure to the document I was just reading into the record, and it gives a breakdown of people who have been evacuated and people who have not been evacuated, and also how many remained. These, then, added together on page 24 in a grand total of those to be and those which have been evacuated amounts to 62,000 persons; however, there is a better breakdown, if Your Honors turn to page 25. This particular document by itself, NOKW-090-a, which is being offered as Prosecution's Exhibit No. 507. This document shows "Table of Evacuation as per: 25 November 1944; number of inhabitants to be evacuated on 9 April 1940: East Finnmark approximately 25,000, West Finnmark approximately 27,000, Trom, Eastward Lyngenfjord approximately 10,000 amounts to 62,000. And then Execution of Evacuation: Evacuees: Evacuees reported via Tromsoe to the south 29,014, via Narvik approximately 3400."
PRESIDING JUDGE BURKE: Mr. Rapp, I don't quite understand the expression "Execution of Evacuation--Evacuees," Paragraph 2, NOKW-090-a, Exhibit 507.
MR. RAPP: That is right, your Honor, what it pertains to is the population to be evacuated in this operation, based on a count of the population made on the 9th of April 1940. It's probably in somewhat awkward translation.
PRESIDING JUDGE BURKE: Yes, it seems a little ambiguous.
MR. RAPP: In other words, they used the official count of the population of the 9th of April 1940 to reach the figure of 62,000. That is the number they were concerned with an intended to evacuate.
JUDGE BURKE: Very well.
MR. RAPP: And then below are the figures they have actually evacuated, listed under Execution of Evacuation, I won't read all these figures into the record. It amounts to about 36,914; and then there are a few left, and then it says "Wehrmacht workers, evacuated with the troops, 285, and it amounts to about 43,300 persons, and then under paragraph 2, they have a number of persons which weren't evacuated; Unable to leave East Finnmark in time, approximately 10,000, and then the number of Lappanders remaining, and refugees avoiding evacuation, and both totals together amount to the grand total of 62,000, which was given at the beginning of this document.
The last document, Your Honors, is an excerpt from a War Diary. It is not signed. Under the entry of 1115 hours, it says: Orientation of the Commander-in-Chief on the situation by the Chief of Staff in the presence of the Ia and Ic.
1.) Report on the situation at the Corps and this is stated in plural. Measures of the Army are approved by the Commander-in-Chief
2.) Nickel Mine Kolosjoki:
The Commander-in-Chief requests that Director General Baron Wrede be informed that transporting and loading of the entire Army will require about 5 - 6 weeks.
Mining the ore during this period is of far-reaching importance to us." "In case difficulties occur, in view of the .....
PRESIDING JUDGE BURKE: Have you found that document?
MR. RAPP: I'm referring to 2026.
DR. FRITSCH: Your Honor, I object to the submission of this document. I have here before me the photostat copy, and on this photostat copy no notes become obvious at all. There are just two typed notes-slips of paper-which at sometime or other were made by some authority or other, and this proves absolutely nothing, and it does not prove that it is part of a War Diary.
PRESIDING JUDGE BURKE: Is that in reference to Exhibit No. 507 or No. 508?
Dr. FRITSCH: The document which was just read by the Prosecution.
MR. RAPP: It has no reference to Exhibit No. 507 or 508; it has a reference to a document which I was about to put in as an exhibit.
PRESIDING JUDGE BURKE:NOKW-064?
MR. RAPP: 064; that is right.
PRESIDING JUDGE BURKE: And your objection, counsel , is what?
DR. FRITSCH: The document 508, Your honor, NOKW-064.
PRESIDING JUDGE BURKE: And will you repeat your objection?
DR. FRITSCH: Your Honor, this is a matter of two typed pages on which there is no reference to any War Diary, to anything coming from a War Diary. The photocopy has not been signed. That has been emphasized already and it also has no head. In my opinion, your Honor, it can have no probative value whatever as such documents can be made any time. Perhaps I may submit this document to the high Tribunal.
PRESIDING JUDGE BURKE: The objection at this time will be overruled.
MR. RAPP: Your Honor, this Document NOKW-064 is being offered as Prosecution Exhibit 508. Under the entry at 1115, it states:
"Orientation of the Commander-in-Chief of the situation by the Chief of Staff in the presence of the 1a and 1c.
"1) Report on the situation at the Corps (plural).
"Measures of the Army are approved by the Commanderin-Chief.
"2) Nickel Mine Kolosjoki:
"The Commander-in-Chief requests that Director General Baron Wredo be informed that transporting and loading of the entire Army will require about 5-6 weeks.
"Mining the ore during this period is of far-reaching importance to us.
In case difficulties occur in view of the importance of the plant for the war effort the Chief of Staff proposes to seize Baron WREDE circumstances permitting, and to force him, under threat of being shot to death to issue orders for the handing over of the plant.
The Commander in Chief gives his approval."
This, your Honors, concludes Document Book No. 22. would like to inquire from the Tribunal if it would be convenient for the Tribunal, possibly, to recess at this time. We are trying to call a witness and I felt we then would not be interrupted in his testimony by the recess if this is agreeable to your Honors.
PRESIDING JUDGE BURKE: I have always been quite arbitrary in the matter of proceeding right up to the allotted time, but I will make this exception and recess at this time.
(A short recess was taken).
THE MARSHAL: The persons in the Courtroom will be seated.
The Tribunal is again in session.
PRESIDING JUDGE BURKE: You may proceed, Mr. Rapp.
MR. RAPP: Thank you very much, your Honor. I have a document before me which we would like to submit at this time, for identification only. It is the script of the Norwegian film which we shall see at four-thirty and then in order not to violate the twenty-four hour rule, we will then ask Monday morning that the document as such be admitted in evidence without having to read the whole script again into the record, which all of us will see this afternoon as part of the picture. I have taken this matter up already with the defense counsel and I believe that defense counsel is agreeable to this.
PRESIDING JUDGE BURKE: Is defense counsel in agreement with the statement made by counsel for the prosecution?
DR. FRITSCH: Fritsch for Rendulic. Your Honor, it only concerns the Defendant Rendulic whom I represent. I have no objection against this decision on the part of the prosecution.
PRESIDING JUDGE BURKE: It is agreed.
MR. RAPP: Your Honors, this is called Document Norway 13-B and it is offered for identification only as 508-A.
If the Court pleases, I should like to request that the Marshal be directed to summon the witness Ferdinand Jodi.
PRESIDING JUDGE BURKE: The Marshal will summon the witness, Ferdinand -
MR. RAPP: Jodl.
PRESIDING JUDGE BURKE: Ferdinand Jodl.
You will raise your right hand, please, and solemnly swear that the testimony given in this matter will be the truth, the whole truth and nothing but the truth so help you God.
You solemnly swear that the testimony that you give in this matter will be the truth, the whole truth and nothing but the truth, so help you God.
(The witness repeated the oath.)
You may be seated.
You may proceed, Mr. Rapp.
MR. RAPP: With your Honors' permission, I would like to examine the witness in the German language.
PRESIDING JUDGE BURKE: There being no objection you may proceed.
FERDINAND JODL DIRECT EXAMINATION BY MR. RAPP:
Q Please give us your full name?
A My name is Ferdinand Jodl.
Q When were you born?
A On 28 November 1896.
Q Where were you born?
A Outside Landau in Palatinate.
Q Are you a German citizen?
A Yes, I am a German citizen.
Q What was your profession, witness?
A I was an active officer.
Q Since when did you have this profession?
A I entered the Army on the 2nd of August 1914.
Q And when were you relieved or when did you retire?
A I retired from the Army on 11 June 1947.
Q Are you married?
A Yes, I am married.
Q Have you any children?
A Yes, I have two children.
Q Were you ever a member of the party or it's affiliations?
A No, I was never a member of the Party or any of it's affiliations.
Q Where do you live now, witness?
A I live now in Wiesbaden. However, I retired to Gummersbach in the Rhineland within the British Zone.
Q Are you now free?
A Yes, I am free now.
Q Where were you as prisoner of war at the end of the war?
A I was an English prisoner of war.
Q When were you relieved?
A On the 11th of June 1947.
Q When did you come to Nurnberg?
A. I arrived at Nurnberg about ten days ago. That was the first time. The second time was this morning at 4 o'clock.
Q During the first day in Nurnberg how many times were you cross examined, interrogated, I should say?
A When first I was in Nurnberg I was three times interrogated.
Q And how long did you stay then on the whole?
A Perhaps five days. I arrived on a Friday and I stayed up until Saturday or Sunday. Sunday we did not work and I stayed another three or four days.
Q Can you describe to us your military career in a few short ters. Witness, you can take your ear phones off because I think you will probably understand me without them.
A In 1914, I joined the Army as an NCO in Augsburg, the 4th Bavarian Artillery Regiment. I became a lieutenant and I left the Reichsheer as a lieutenant. During the first World War I served only in the West and only with this regiment at the front. After the end of the First World War I entered, after a short interval, the Reich Army, the Reichswehr; until about 1922 I served at Landsberg as a 1st and 2nd Lieutenant in the 7th Reichswehr Artillery Regiment and then a short time in Munich.
From 1927 to 1929 I was on a Fuehrer's assistance course in Westphalia. From 1929 to 1934 I was in the Reichswehr Ministry as an assistant Fuehrer. Then afterwards in the Department of Foreign Armies. I was in charge of the Russian group. In 1934 until 1935 -
PRESIDING JUDGE BURKE: Witness, a little slower, please.
A 1934 to 1935 I was Battery Chief in Ansbach. 1935 to 1938 I was a teacher of War Tactics at the War Academy in Berlin. 1938 I joined Command of the 12th Corps as Ia to Wiesbaden. In this position I was still when the war broke out. Then, according to my memory, in May 1940, I became of this particular corps. For about 14 days during the offensive in Yugoslavia I was appointed Chief of the General Staff of the 49 Mountaineer Corps and Chief of the General Staff of the 12th Corps -- I was only in the West, as the Chief of the General Staff of the 49th Corps, I was at various points; that is, in France about a fortnight in the Jugoslavian offensive and then, just at the beginning of the Russian campaign I was in Slovakia and also in Poland in the area west of Lemberg-Lwow as Chief of the General Staff of the 49th Mountaineer Corps.
I participated in the offensive against Russia. My unit was at that time in the Donetz Basin and in the vicinity north of the Asow Sea. Approximately on the 10th of January, 1942 I was appointed Chief of the General Staff of the then Army High Command - Lappland which was later the 20th Mountaineer Army. I arrived about the 20th of January, 1942 in Rovanjemi which is in Finland and I remained there and in the same position until the end of February 1944.
Effective the 1st of February, 1944 I was appointed into the Leader Reserve of the OKH and I was transferred and taken to Wiesbaden, which is my native town, and to wait for further orders for my future command.
At the beginning of April the order reached me there to the effect that I should go back to Rovanjemi in order to take over the leadership of the 19th Mountain Corps at the Ice Sea Fron. On 20th April 1944 I took over the leadership of this particular unit. In September 1944 I was appointed commanding general of the Corps. In this capacity I was in the defensive war against the Russian attack on 7 October 1944 where we only succeeded under heavy sacrifices in saving my unit from being kept in a pincer movement by the Superior Russian forces and I managed to take my corps back to Norway.
Then, until the final capitulation, I hold the same position, being the officer in command of this Corps. Then approximately at the end of November 1944, I was given the tactical leadership after being in charge of operations of the Army Department Narvik which consisted, apart from my own units, also of the 71st Corps.
Q. Witness, within what larger unit did the 19th Corps fight? Outside of the 19th Corps, what was subordinated to the 20th Mountain Corps and who was the Supreme Command or of the 20th Mountain Army?
A. The Supreme Commander in command of the 20th Mountain Army was at first General Dietl and later on General Rondulic and in the end it was the General of the mountain troops Bochme.
Q. Witness, did you know General Rondulic? Did you know him personally?
A General Rondulic I met first, as far as remember, in Finland.
Q Did you know him personally, witness?
A Yes, I know him personally.
Q Can you recognize him in here in court?
A. Yes, yes.
PRESIDING JUDGE BURKE: You are overlapping the questions and answers. Space the timing between the question and the answer.
Q Witness, will you please leave a small interval between my questions and your answers?
PRESIDING JUDGE BURKE: And more interval between and tho next question.
MR. RAPP: Very well, your Honor.
Q Witness, can you point out to us the then General Rendulic, now the defendant Rendulic?
A Yes.
Q Where does he sit?
A General Rendulic is sitting here opposite me,
Q In figures -- speaking in figures, where is he sitting from the left?
A He is the sixth.
Q Thank you. Witness, did your army corps under your command take part in the evacuation, or the so-called evacuation of the province of Finmark?
A Yes, my army corps took part in this.
Q Witness, when did you hear for the first time of forced evacuation of Finmark and that such an evacuation was to take place?
A It is not pass ole for me any longer now to give you a date. I am afraid I do not remember. I can only say for certain that various preludes and considerations occurred before the actual Fuehrer order or Army Order came through during the last days of October and arrived at our army corps.
Q Witness, although as you state here, you can't remember any exact date or any tine at all in connection with the Finmurk evacuation, when you did hoar about it, did you take any steps -- that is, before you received the actual Fuehrer order?
A I can roll remember one discussion which I had with General Hoelter but that was a discussion which took place before the Fuehrer order arrived. It must have taken place before the Fuehrer order arrived. This discussion was to the following effect:
"Herr Hoelter, I intend to make an application in writing to the effect that any destruction and evacuation of Finmark should not take place for the following reasons:
"First, my unit which is absolutely exhausted by the various attacks and offensives has something else to do than to deal with evacuations and destruction. We are glad if we can bring our 5,000 rounded into safety to the West and can get supplies of the most necessary things, materials, et cetera. We have no columns in order to transport population.
"Second, I do not believe that the Russians will proceed to the host and will cross the Tana. We are not in touch with them any longer -- with the Russians, that is. We know for certain that the bulk of the Russian units have been transported to the East and, even if the Russians should rant to pursue us, they would be acting differently.
"Third, if we force the population to evacuate and if we burn their houses we therewith create miss givings and ill will amongst the Norwegian population and ombitterment and this ombitterment can be of no practical use to us. We even have to reckon with tho springing in to life of a partisan movement."
When I told this to General Hoelter, he answered: "The A.O.K. is roughey of the same opinion as you but just now the order" -- I do not know exactly what exactly he said it was, a Fuehrer Order or whatever it was -- "has arrived according to which destruction has to be carried out" -- that destruction, that is, and the evacuation -- ''and nothing can be done now. The submission of an application in writing is therefore no longer of any use."
Q Witness, who was General Hoelter?
A General Hoelter was the Chief of the General Staff of the Mountain A.O.K. 20.
Q And as such General Hoelter was subordinate to General Rendulic?
A. He was subordinate to General Rendulic.
Q Witness, the discussion which you had with General Hoelter and the arrival of this so-called Fuehrer order were almost simultaneous, weren't they?
A. So I assume.
Q Did you speak to General Hoelter personally?
A Yes, I spoke to him personally.
Q By telephone?
A Yes, by telephone.
Q Witness, in the last days of October of the year 1944, did you have direct contact with the Russian troops?
A I do not remember the date of the last fighting with the Russians any more but it must have been approximately around the 25th of October when the last fight took place that is in consequence of the Russian pincer movement on the east of the River Tana.
Q At this time, this date, 25 October 1944, was if I understand you correctly after the time at which the Russians as you said transported larger units to the East, is that correct?
A Yes, this transfer of strong Russian units must have taken a long time, because the Russians had opposed to my own corps about four or five corps to ours. That is quite a bit of transport, it took a lot of transportation to transfer then to other parts.
Q Alright, witness, I shall put my question in a different way; was the transport at that time in great part concluded, or was it only just starting?
A It must have been like this, that the persecution of Kirkenes was only carried out by only a few snail Russian units, and they were originally directed against my own corps.
Q Witness, in your own Army Corps, did you have a so-called 1-c officer; was he in contact with the 1-C officer of the Army?
A Yes, that is correct.
Q At this date we are speaking about, now what, if you can remember, what did the 1-C officer tell you about the enemy position for the enemy intentions, I should say, referring to the mass pursuit of the 20th German Army?
A I probably misjudged the enemy position at this particular point. In the vicinity of Kirkenes there were only about three corps left, or at least we could only establish the existence of three enemy corps. In the direction of Neiden there were even less enemy troops, and beyond Neiden there advanced only very weak Russian forces which went to the West. Contact with the enemy had been lost none or less. Without doubt the enemy left its strong forces either around Potsamo, or he had already transferred them to the south. During the last days of October, in any case, there was no indication whatsoever that the Russians should keep on pursuing us across the Tana River to the West, or that he intended to do so. An absolute guarantee for this, of course, we did not have, because as I already mentioned before the Russians just as at the time when they crossed the Finnish-Norwegian border, also in this case he could stop for sometime at the Tana River in order to wait for the result of some political negotiations with the exiled Norwegian Government.
THE PRESIDENT: Pardon me, just a minute. I do not in anyway wish to direct the prosecution in its questioning, but personally I would be interested in knowing if the prosecutor wishes to present the matter at this time, where this particular river is.
MR. RAPP: Your Honor, I have just that in mind and have been trying to make arrangements to have one of the representatives of the Norwegian. Government to point these places out for us.
THE PRESIDENT: Maybe the witness could do it. However, that is a matter for you to decide.
UNKNOWN GENTLEMAN: (Indicating on map with rule) This is the Tana River and the Tana fiord.
MR. RAPP: Would you be so kind as to stay there?
THE PRESIDENT: You are now having a person testify who has not been sworn or called as a witness. The witness can do so or can try to do so. He should be able to.
MR. RAPP: I am merely trying to do this for the convenience of the Tribunal. If you wish I can have the witness stand and show it to us.
THE PRESIDENT: That is the proper way to do it, rather than having two witnesses on the stand at one time. It should be suggested that he (the witness) speak into the microphone.
Q Will you please show us the Tana River?
A The Tana River is this border river which flows into the Tana fiord. It is a large river, and this is the road by which we rotreated. (indicating) And beyond the Tana River, to the west the Russians did not advance.
Q Witness, up to now you spoke of so-called assumptions which at that time you had about the intentions of the Russians; did these assumptions actually come true, that is did the Russians actually advance to the west along this line?
AApart from a few reconnaissance troops the Russians did not actually advance to the west.
C, And when, or at what state, witness, did this take place, and how did it become more and more evident?
A It is very difficult to give a date, because everyday showed more and more that the Russians were for the time being not advancing with stronger forces.
Q Witness, if I understand you correct, that did not become evident until April 1944, when I speak of dates I mean not only just a particular day, but I mean months?
A It was absolutely clear that as far as one could speak of the future at that time the Russians did not intend to advance, unless they intended to start an offensive in the north.
Q From when on did that become evident, witness?
A I could say that from the middle of November it became suite evident that this particular phase of activities had come to an end, and if the Russians intended to advance again that this would be a new campaign, as it was. A date, of course, would be merely arbitrary.
Q Witness, did you. receive this order by the 20th Army about the evacuation of Finnmark?
A Yes, I received it.
Q In writing?
AAs far as I remember, in teletype.
Q On the basis of this order within your unit did the compulsory evacuation begin immediately?
A Yes, it had to begin, because we were in a hurry.
Q Witness, how long did this compulsory evacuation take?
A I am not in a position to make any binding statements about this point as it did not concern me until the beginning of November, and later the compulsory evacuation was supervised by a staff which exclusively been appointed for this purpose.
Q Then give us the date, at what date or approximately what date did you know about this, directly or personally?
A We had to deal with evacuation measures approximately as from November 1 until at the most the 10 or 15 of November, because when I changed my fighting position later from the Tana River to the west I arrived at villages as a rule which had already been completely or partly evacuated.
Q. Witness, were these villages absolutely destroyed?
A. No. When I arrived at these villages, they were not destroyed* Nothing had been destroyed, because our whole unit was actually housed and stationed in these villages. We had to find accommodations, because it was winter and we were near the Ice Sea.
Q. Witness, was the 230th Division within your corps? Was it a unit of your corps?
A. The 230th Division was in my area, but when they came under my command I do not remember anymore in detail.
Q. The evacuation staff which you have just mentioned, which was formed later on, and the main task of which was to supervise the evacuation and carry it out -- now where did this staff receive its troops and men?
A. I should prefer not to say anything about this date, because I had no personal contact with the staff. I had no contact at all, no immediate contact, with them. I never met the staff; therefore I would not like to make just any old statement about something which I do not know for certain.
Q. In other words, witness, the troops of the XIX Corps, which you were in charge of, were never put at the disposal of the staff for evacuation purposes?
A. As far as I know now, and furthermore I don't believe they had any troops. They must have had only columns. It is possible they had columns. It is possible, however, that my quartermaster might have put a column at the disposal of the evacuation staff.
Q. What do you mean, column?
A. Motorized column. If you mean units of any size, regiments, etc., no, that is absolutely out of the question.
Q. Witness, you say you arrived at villages which had been evacuated but which had not been destroyed. Were there any people left in these villages?
A. I have already said that most of the villages were absolutely empty, but on occasions I saw one or two civilians who were packing something.