Q. General, I discussed that point with you because under Count IV of the indictment this comes in. But I shall now want to discuss something else with you, please. Mummenthey was the chief of a number of enterprises which are being connected with the SS. Let me ask you a preliminary question first. Did you know Mummenthey personally during the war?
A. I believe I saw him once or twice.
Q. To continue, Mummenthey was chief or business manager of a number of these enterprises. I shall refer only to the Dest, which is the German Earth and Sone Works, and the Allach Porcelain Manufacturing Company. Now, I'm interested in this question. One has to ask oneself, what did the SS, especially in view of what you said yesterday, have to do with economic and industrial enterprises? I should like to ask you, General, in this connection to tell the Court whether you know the reasons which led to the establishment or acquisition of such works and enterprises. I should like to start with the Allach plant. Do you know, Witness, what reasons led to the acquisition of the Allach Works by the SS?
A. I know that very well. As the SS, as I described yesterday, was to be an elite and select group in all sorts of fields of life, the Reichsfurhrer SS wished, and ordered to extend these characteristics of the SS to wider fields. For those reasons he created this porcelain factory in Allach as a sort of advertisement for the cultural tendencies of the SS. There extremely valuable and highly artistic porcelain was manufactured which was so first rate that all the technical difficulties were overcome which are encountered in manufacturing a horse or horseman in porcelain which are only carried by the two slim legs of the horse, without all the usual allegorical supports of the horse, such as a tree, a bush or a flower or anything like that. Even all the other famous German manufacturing places such as Meissen, Nymphenburg, etc., never achieved that technical perfection. It was the Heichsfuehrer's wish to have the two SS insignia on every single figure manufactured in Allach to advertise thereby the origin and the select quality of the SS.
Q. General, I am interested merely in the question here whether the establishment of the Allach plant was connected at all with the labor allocation of inmates, or to put it in another way, according to your statements was it possible at all that such enterprises as Allach indiscriminately would use inmates, or were conditions different? I do not want to put a leading question to you.
A. Perhaps I might add that this porcelain plant, as I remember it, up to 1938 received and needed considerable financial subsidies. It therefore was not a profit-bearing enterprise, and for that purpose the money contributed by the circle of friends, of which I was a part, was used. Inmates, as long as I still had my office in Berlin, were not used for that. It was the highly skilled, carefully trained personnel, small in number, which worked on these things.
Q. Did similar standards apply to the Bohemia plant?
A. I remember that Bohemia was acquired after the incorporation of the Sudetenland into the Reich on the basis of the Munich agreement. At that time the Reichsfuehrer was interested to have, apart from the artistic porcelain, a very nice looking porcelain and give that to his SS leaders and SS men at a cheap price.
For that reason the Bohemia was taken over at the time, and as I recall, it used a large number of workers, including native workers, consisting of about five hundred or six hundred men.
Q. Witness, now do you know anything about the reason why DEST was established, the German Earth & Stone Works?
A. Now about DEST I regret to say I am unable to say anything very exact. I am unable to make a responsible statement.
DR. FROESCHMANN: That is most regrettable because I would like to have heard you about this point. I have no further questions now as the witness cannot answer that question.
BY DR. HOFFMANN (For Defendant Scheide):
Q. Witness, it is possible that this Tribunal might put to my client that three million Jews were exterminated, and that this was a logical consequence from the party program. What is your opinion of this?
THE PRESIDENT: Your question is too broad, "What is your opinion of this". Ask him something more specific, more restricted.
Q. (By Dr. Hoffmann) Witness, in the verdict against Milch, the Tribunal explained that one point of the party program was "Citizen can only be a German. No Jew can be a citizen." Also the Jewish legislation was referred to. My question to you is, as far as the party program is concerned, and the later laws against the Jews, are these things a logical--or rather is the later extermination program of the Jews, is that a necessary consequence of the party program?
A. It is my personal conviction that it isn't, because in the party program, and above all in the instructions and the ideological training of the SS, there was never any reference to extermination and annihilation of the Jews. No propaganda of that sort was ever made.
Q. What was the solution envisaged then?
A. As far as this problem reached the Reichsfuehrer-SS or the Fuehrer's headquarters for discussions or debates, I never heard the theory of the extermination, only the theory of resettlement, and that is that.
I also believe that practically speaking that after 1933 Jews were advised to emigrate. I know, for instance, that Jewish managers of the Dresdner Bank who had long-term contracts, were compensated with 35,000 marks or 50,000 marks, and then emigrated. I know that after the wave of arrests following the murder of the diplomat Von Rath in November, 1938, emigration of Jews on a large scale was worked on and sponsored, and the purpose and intention behind it was to give people a shock by temporary arrest.
Q. Witness, how can you explain this murder in that case?
A. Perhaps I may say first of all that you and I, Mr. Attorney did not prepare that sort of examination, and I am somewhat surprised at your question, and I am now faced with the very difficult task to improvise a judgment of a profound significance. May I just finish my sentence, please? I am one of the few survivors of the people who had knowledge of and participated in the highest German leadership circles, but having been imprisoned for two years, more than on year of which was spent in solitary confinement, I was completely cut off of all possibilities to inform myself on that subject, which was unknown to me and remained unknown to me, by talking to another few of the few other survivors, thereby to reach a historically correct, tenable and responsible conclusion about which I could make a statement.
Q. Witness, perhaps I can try and help you here as far as I am able to do so. The solution of the Jewish question surely must have been discussed in your circle since 1933, and what did you discuss; actually what was said?
A. All I can do is assure you that as far as we in the SS were concerned, this may sound fantastic the first moment, we did not put the Jewish problem in the foreground of propaganda campaigns, deliberations or conferences. Our training was to the effect to think of the greater Germany, to work for that purpose, to give out best for the incorporation of all those fellow Germans who, by the shortsightedness of the Versailles dictate, which was not in accordance with German cultural national and linguistic communities.
We wanted to have the countries like Austria, Sudetengau, Memel. We wanted to have all those areas back mainly, which in 1935 voted for this, 81 percent, for Germany. We wished to settle these things peacefully in the interest of a new, greater Germany and a new and greater Europe.
These broad ideas were the training which the SS received, and it was definitely regarded as bad taste to deal with political questions of the day and discuss these things.
Q. Do you mean to say, witness, that the individual SS man was not particularly interested in the Jewish question?
A. I must say truthfully that the attitude of the SS man, as far as a negative attitude was concerned, was quite clear towards Jewry, and obviously without the accent being on hatred -- with the overwhelming majority of the SS. So, therefore, one cannot say that there was any propaganda necessary for hatred or persecution. Perhaps I may recall what I said yesterday. It would not have been in accordance with the spirit of chivalry and fairness to do anything against Jews in normal times, to enrich oneself in those times. Is that sufficient for you?
Q. But why was it that Himmler still became a hangman?
A. Well, as I said before, I do not know. I would ask you, as far as the Tribunal does not wish that I should give here my improvised and personal opinion, not to insist on my answering that sort of question, because what I am telling here I believe will one day be of historical significance, and, therefore, I would like you to understand that I do not wish to make statements about delicate matters before I am in a position to form a really extensive and well-oriented conviction - which up to this time my imprisonment has prevented me from doing.
Q. Witness, one more question. If my client, defendant Scheide, will take the witness stand, and I would ask him whether he knew anything about the extermination program of the Jews, it is my conviction that he will be justified in saying no. That answer will be somewhat difficult because no one has been able to say anything about the fact at all how the extermination came about. And I would like to ask you once again whether you could not really help a little in enlightening us because the fact that nobody knew anything will speak, in my opinion, against all of them - not only defendants in this trial but it will reach deep down into the ranks of the SS.
A. I regret that I am unable to add anything to my former statements but I am quite willing to, as far as Scheide is concerned, who is a decent SS man of long standing and I know him personally, I am quite happy to testify here that, to the best of my belief and knowledge, and to my firm conviction, he knew as little as I did. And I don't think it would be justified to expect it of him, who worked on the fringes, rather than of me who worked in the highest leadership circles.
BY DR. FICHT (Counsel for the defendant Klein):
Q. Witness, do you know the defendant Horst Klein?
A. Yes, I do.
Q. Do you know what his activities were under defendant Pohl?
A. I remember first of all his construction tasks which he carried out for the Wewelsburg. But, as far as I can remember, that was the first personal contact which I had with Klein.
Q. Now, as you yourself mentioned Wewelsburg immediately, which is the subject I wanted to ask you about, I can therefore start on that. What sort of construction program was Wewelsburg?
A. Wewelsburg is an old castle situated near Paderborn in Westphalia and which was designated by the Reichsfuehrer SS to be renovated. He decided that it must be extended and that it should become a sort of parallel to the Marienburg in Western Prussia which, of course, was the center of the old teutonic order of knights in Western Prussia. The purpose, once it was completed, was that it was to be used as a suitable locality for conferences of the highest SS leaders, Gruppenfuehrers and Obergruppenfuehrers. Originally it was to admit only male members, but later on the wives were also permitted. This program, therefore, was one which concerned the Reichsfuehrer very personally. Certain ideals also were at the back of it and its extension in peacetime was taken care of in an honorary capacity by the Reich Labor Service.
Q. Now, who ordered this construction to be carried out?
A. The order came from the Reichsfuehrer SS. He ordered it.
Q. He ordered that personally?
A. Yes.
Q. Who was in charge of the construction program at Wewelsburg?
A. That was Bartels, an architect.
Q. What was Bartels' agency? Where did he work?
A. He came from-- As the Reichsfuehrer was so interested personally, Bartels was a member of Himmler's personal staff.
Q. What was his rank?
A. Sturmbannfuehrer, and Obersturmbannfuehrer up to 1943, I don't know what his rank was at the end of the war. I am unable to say for certain because I was in Italy.
Q. Did the defendant Klein have the right to issue orders to Bartels?
A. In no way at all.
Q. Who drew up the plans for Wewelsburg and who approved them?
A. The Reichsfuehrer SS approved them and he also ordered them.
Q. Who submitted the plans to the Reichsfuehrer; who reported about it?
A. Bartels, whenever the Reichsfuehrer SS visited Wewelsburg, reported to the Reichsfuehrer and whenever they inspected the castle from room to room he suggested improvements and corrections.
Q. Was Klein called in regularly to these conferences?
A. No, I recall only one occasion when Klein was present briefly at a conference, the subject being to find out whether Klein was in a position to provide the necessary funds for a certain idea of an extension which the Reichsfuehrer had developed.
Q. Do you know that Klein in the spring of 1943 suggested to Himmler that the construction be discontinued?
A. Yes.
Q. Do you know why Klein did this?
A. At that time, when the war situation became more difficult, a general limitation and stoppage of building programs had been declared officially. Klein had justifiable misgivings that the Reichsfuehrer SS on the one hand, being the chief of German Police, would punish anybody who violated that decree, but in his personal capacity as the highest sponsor of the Wewelsburg would claim it to be an exception in this connection.
Q. Who ordered this construction program to be financed?
A. The Reichsfuehrer SS.
Q. Did the defendant Pohl have any influence on the extent and the execution of the building program?
A. No, the Reichsfuehrer SS decided on the extent and the execution. Of course he would discuss it occasionally with Pohl or Klein whether, and at what time, the money necessary to pay the firms-
Q. Was there any possibility for Pohl to interfere with the building program, that this should be done in one way and that in another?
A. That did not exist at all.
Q. Do you know the connection between Klein and the actual building? What did he do? What were his activities?
A. As far as I can recall, he had to raise the money; he had to negotiate with the local firms and local inhabitants, as well as the representatives of the church - a clergyman called Pusch in Wewelsburg and the Bishop of Paderborn - about the selling and the compensation for the land necessary for the extension of Wewelsburg.
Q. Do you know whether that purchase of the land was done on a voluntary or on a forced basis?
A. Yes, I know that. As far as I know, they were all carried out on a voluntary basis.
Q. Do you know the case of von Mallingrod?
A. Yes, I recall that. The estate owner of Mallingrod at the beginning attempted to get the Reichsfuehrer SS interested in paying more money for his estate than was actually justified. I remember extremely wall that be asked 4,000,000 at the beginning and the Reichsfuehrer-SS was highly indignant about this excessive demand and he ordered first of all to choose the method of compulsory seizure on a legal basis. Legal pressure should be applied so that the estate would be sold more in accordance with its value.
Q. Do you know if this ever was carried out?
A. Yes, I know that thereupon Mallingrod lowered his price very considerably. I believe it was between 2,7 -- or I don't remember the details. I don't remember the details, but I think it was somewhere between 2.3 and 2.7 million which were handled by the Reichsfuehrer SS in a decent and generous manner. It was an entirely friendly agreement both between the Reichsfuehrer SS and Herr Von Mallingrod, as well as the Bishop of Paderborn
Q. Do you know anything, Witness, that the owners of land in that part of the world were dissatisfied by the prices they were paid?
A. What I recall otherwise is only the so-called Kallmeier Estate, and that problem, as far as I know, was solved to the satisfaction of the inhabitants because the Reichsfuehrer was not interested in building his favorite castle at a place where, for reasons of its, strong Catholic tendencies, he did not wish to have an unnecessary antagonism against himself as the new owner of the castle.
He wanted to live in his favorite castle peacefully.
Q. One more question about the way money was raised by Klein as you mentioned before. Would Klein, had he refused to put the money at the disposal of Bartels have been able to avoid the construction being carried out?
A. No, Bartels would have referred that to the Reichsfuehrer and Klein would then have been charged with sabotaging an order by the Reichsfuehrer and he would have been punished somewhat heavily.
Q. Now another topic about Wewelsburg. Do you know who the workers were who worked there; you wanted to start about that earlier?
A. I know that in peacetime skilled work was carried out by firms which had been contacted through the usual methods of free economy. It was regarded as an honorary work for the manual work, the earth,work. The Reich Labor Service sent a detachment led by a man called Zimmermann.
Q. So therefore inmates were not used from the outset?
A. No. No.
Q. Do you know who ordered for the first time that inmates should be used in Wewelsburg and when that occurred?
A. What I know is that when Wewelsburg was inspected by Eicke and the Reichsfuehrer and when he became aware of the shortage skilled workers caused by the war, he offered to the Reichsfuehrer to put a small number of well famed skilled workers, mainly, I think Jehovah's witnesses, at the disposal of the Reichsfuehrer in order to have this work carried out during the brief duration of the war, as we believed then.
Q. And you said just now at the beginning of the war. When was that, roughly?
A. -- I believe it was the beginning of the war, I believe in 1940.
Q. Do you know that inmates were used to an increased degree by order and when this happened, roughly?
A. As I remember, the extension to several hundreds of inmates -- it might have been between 350 and 450 inmates -- came in 1940 to 1941.
Q. Do you happen to know who ordered this at the time?
A. It would be saying too much that I know it, but as I recall, it was the Reichsfuehrer who gave the order.
Q. Do you know that Bartels in order to speed up this work insisted with Himmler that more inmates should be used?
A. Yes.
Q. Then finally there is the camp of inmates which existed there and was that camp under the orders of the Defendant Klein?
A. No.
Q. Do you know who was the camp commandant of the inmates camp at Wewelsburg?
A. Yes, that was Hauptsturmfuehrer Haas.
Q. Who was his superior officer?
A. As far as I know, the Inspector of the concentration camps.
Q. Did the Defendant Klein have the right to issue any orders to this camp commandant?
A. No.
Q. Did Klein have any influence on labor allocation of inmates as far as the building was concerned?
A. No.
Q. Where was the camp situated on the site?
A. At first, when it was small, it was situated near the hills, the wooded hills, close by the castle, between the castle and the situation of Wewelsburg. When it grew it was transferred to the Boettigen estate, which belonged to Herr von Mallingrod.
Q. Therefore, it was at some distance from the building program when it had grown?
A. Yes.
Q. Did you ever inspect the camp at Wewelsburg?
A. Yes, accompanying the Reichsfuehrer, I went through this camp.
Q. What was your impression of that camp?
A. The same impression which I described to the Tribunal in the Milch Trial. The inmates at that time were well fed. Food was adequate. We even talked to some of the inmates. We asked them and I remember that the inmates had a certain number of spaces at their disposal and where they raised fresh vegetables, potatoes and other food to improve their food supplies.
Q. And when was that inspection?
A. I think it must have been in the Spring of 1941.
Q. Was Klein present by any chance?
A. I am unable to say that for certain.
DR. FIGHT: No further questions.
THE PRESIDENT: Any further examination by defense counsel?
Mr. Robbins, you may cross-examine.
CROSS-EXAMINATION.
BY MR. ROBBINS:
Q. General, before we get too far away from Wewelsburg, I should like to tell you that a part of the proof in this case consists of the testimony of an SS man about the conditions at Wewelsburg.
A. I am so sorry. I have not hear one word of the German translation.
INTERPRETER: I expect, Your Honor, he is not on Channel 3 as he should be.
WITNESS: I can hear now.
Q. General, I say before we get too far away from Wewelsburg, I should like to tell you that a part of the proof in this case consists of the testimony about the conditions in Wewelsburg. He says about five hundred inmates were working there under the defendant Klein and that Haas, whom you mentioned, was subordinate to Kleim and that many inmates were worked to death in the construction there. He says that the causes of the death of the prisoners in Wewelsburg were malnutrition; they were not given enough food; they were willfully worked to death in the quarry, in the pebble detachment; and (3) the extermination of prisoners who were unpopular, by order of the defendant Klein and Haas. Did you hear about those conditions?
A. The conditions just described by the prosecution I heard nothing about; and at least as far as the periods of which I have knowledge that is until 1941 myself are concerned, I am compelled to call these things completely untrue. I'm sure that it is quite easy to contradict this statement by a prisoner.
Q. General, I'm not talking about the description by the prosecution. This is a description by an SS man who was there on the spot. If an SS man said that, it probably happened, didn't it? You don't doubt the veracity of an SS man, do you?
A. It is quite possible to have among one million SS men a few sons of bitches, (Schweinehund). I don't know the motives of this SS man. Neither do I know his name. But I feel quite sure that a description which is so fantastically untrue in all its basic features would be easily contradicted. It would be child's play to contradict this statement if only I knew the name of this inmate and if this prisoner were brought here. If, for instance, the attorney of Klein would find out the prisoner's data, his criminal record, and so forth, then it would become clear what his motives were in making this statement, which is not only an exaggeration but a typical distortion.
Q. This testimony was given by SS man Heinrich Reinhold Kurt Wilhelm Schwarz.
The SS didn't take in people with criminal records, did they?
A. Not generally speaking. But this is what I want to say. The reputation, the judgment of the man's personality, his personal background, his native village, and all that, the profession from which he joined the SS-also I would like to hear what his comrades in the SS would think about him -
Q. He is talking about a period in April 1942. Were you in Wewelsburg at that time?
A. I have not seen my diaries for two years; I have not seen my adjutant nor my secretary. I have been cut off from anything which would support my memory. Therefore, I can say something only according to my knowledge and belief. I do not believe, however, that in 1942 I visited Wewelsburg. My last visit, I think, must have been in 1941 because in 1942 I was in the Ukraine with the Fuehrer near Winnitza.
Q. Yes, I think that's right. So from you own personal knowledge you can't exclude the possibility that the description of this SS man is correct since you weren't there; is that right?
A. I cannot guarantee how the internal conditions in Wewelsburg developed after my last visit there; but I am absolutely able from my long and detailed knowledge of Klein to guarantee fully that he cannot have been responsible for these things because it was not part of his duties; and it would not have been in accordance with the organization of the WNHA.
Q. It wasn't a part of his duties, was it, to starve people to death or work them to death? That wasn't part of his duties, was it?
A. No, no.
Q. You tell me that these conditions are fantastic? Is this the first time that you have ever heard that inmates were worked to death in the SS economic enterprises?
A. After the surrender and now in connection with these trials, I have heard about this, that is to say, from the book of Kogon which I read.
Please don't blame me if I don't have a very high opinion of the probative value of this book. I think it is a distorted document. His knowledge -
Q. Excuse me. You don't doubt today, do you, that inmates were worked to death in the quarries and in the economic enterprises of the SS?
A. At this time I have been unable to form an impression. I was told this. It was put to me. I saw it in the papers and heard it on the wireless, read it and heard about it. Far be it from me to regard it as my task to spared doubts about the fact that in concentration camps, above all in the middle of the war, outrageous conditions arose. But one should not forget in this connection that even Kogon admits that -
Q. We'll go into that a bit later.
THE TRIBUNAL (JUDGE MUSMANNO): General, why don't you answer Mr. Robbins' questions directly? He has stated very specifically that you don't doubt today after all this evidence which has come to your attention in the way of reports, letters, and affidavits you don't doubt that there were excesses and that people were actually worked to death in the labor camps. You don't doubt that today, do you? That is the question which Mr. Robbins put.
A. I do not doubt that to a certain extent these things occurred; but of the real extent I am unable to form a judgment because nobody has submitted any proven evidence to me.
THE TRIBUNAL (Judge Musmanno) Very well.
A. Interrogators told me this, and I have to take their word for it.
BY MR. ROBBINS:
Q. And you don't have any doubts, do you, General, that people died from undernourishment in concentration camps?
A. I do not doubt that.
Q. It is not fantastic, though, is it, to assume that they did?
A. No, because German prisoners of war also did after the surrender.
Q. General, I should like to go back to a more pleasant subject. You held a very high and important position in German life; and I'm not satisfied that Dr. Seidl completely brought out the full significance of the important position that you hold. So I should like to go back over a few of those details, if you please; and I would like to ask you about the nature of these different positions and the duties and functions which you carried out in those positions, as well as the dates when you held those positions. I believe you told us that you were the highest SS and Police leader in Italy. Will you tell us what that was about?
A. My rank as the highest SS and Police Leader in Italy entailed the task of providing law and order, security and peaceful working conditions in the rear of the army area, at the back of the German Southern front, which was involved in very heavy fighting at the time.
Q. Is a highest SS and Police Leader something different from a Higher SS and Police Leader?
A. Yes. First of all the name, the superlative "highest", shows that it is the highest rank in that department. Moreover, the prosecution should take into consideration the fact that there is a distinction between the Highest Police and SS Leader in occupied territory outside Germany and a Highest SS and Police Leader in Germany itself. These are two distinct positions, and tasks are equally distinct.
Q. As a Highest SS and Police Leader, who was your immediate superior?
A. The Reich Fuehrer SS.
Q. You were assigned to the Duce in Italy. Will you tell us what functions you carried out there?
A. I was assigned to the Duce as a consultant in police matters. The overthrow of the Duce and his capture on 25 July 1943 showed that the Italian security police and the famous 150 Musketeers of the Duce, his personal, well-proven bodyguards-failed -
Q. Excuse me. I must have misunderstood you. In your assignment as liaison officer to the Duce, it wasn't a part of your duties to capture the Italian forces, was it, or to negotiate their surrender? Continue with your answer.
A. I believe there is a misunderstanding here. What I want to say is this. I just wanted to describe my duties with the Duce. I'm quite willing to follow the prosecution's idea that as to the Duce's personal security, his life, I was responsible for these things to the Fuehrer and the Reichfuehrer. My second assignment was to advise him when he re-established a reliable Fascist security police and when he also formed the new police, regular police, both based on the example of the SS.
Q. In this position who was your superior?
A. In this position the Reichsfuehrer SS was my superior and my highest superior, of course, the Fuehrer.
Q. During what period of time did you hold this position?
A. That position I hold from the day after the so-called Badoglio surrender of 9 September 1943 until the capitulation in May 1945.
Q. And --- During what period of time did you hold the position of Highest SS and Police Leader in Italy?
A. I made a slight mistake there. In the period which I mentioned just now from the 9th of September to May 1945 I was Highest SS and Police Leader. Of course, only after the Duce was liberated from Monte Sasso I was assigned to him then. This occurred roughly in the middle of September, I think between the 16th and the 23rd of September 1943.
THE PRESIDENT: The Tribunal is in recess for 15 minutes.
THE MARSHAL: The Tribunal will be in recess 15 minutes.
(A recess was taken)
MARSHALL: Military Tribunal # 2 is again in session.
BY MR. ROBBINS:
Q. General, you were chief of the personal staff of Reichsfuehrer-SS Himmler. Will you tell us the nature of that staff and the nature of your duties?
A. The personal staff of the Reichsfuehrer-SS had the task of assisting the Reichsfuehrer in carrying out his numerous tasks and relieving him on some of the workload. This working staff was subdivided mainly into his personal adjutant's office, which dealt with all visitors and all appointments for him. Then there were his personal experts such as Dr. Rudolf Brandt, who is known to the Prosecutor from the medical trial and to the Tribunal too, who dealt with all his correspondence. Then there was the police adjutant's office dealing with security, police and order questions directly with the Reichsfuehrer. Then there was the Reich correspondence department which took care of files, and then there was the financial administration which disposed of funds which he received, either from the party or from the state, and finally he had a main department dealing with guests and invitations he sent out, as well as decorations and there was the personnel department. In addition to that there were a number of officers attached to his personal staff which from the organization point of view could not be placed in any other main department, or which were particularly close to the Reichsfuehrer-SS, and whom he wanted in his vicinity.
Would this description of the tasks be sufficient for the Prosecutor, or do you want me to go into further details? For instance, would you like me to describe what the raw materials office handled and why that raw material department was attached to the personal staff and to me, and not, as one might assume, come under the WVHA, where one would assume it to be?
Q. No, that is adequate. This was a main office in the Reich Leadership SS, was it not?